Bark Like a Dog and Wave a Flag

Anyone check out this new John Kerry 2008 site?

This a site dedicated to John Kerry and his run for 2008 for President of the United States of America.

On November 2nd, 2004 over 57 million Americans voted for change (the most votes for any challenger in history), they voted for a man who they trust, a man who they knew would bring a stronger America. On Tuesday November 4th, 2008 we as Americans are once again ready to vote for him and put him in the oval office so he can fight for us and stop the corruption and bring back the best of America...

Election day is Tuesday, November 4th, 2008!

Keep checking back often as we update this site!

Tell your freinds about this site:
http://Kerry08.tripod.com

I would like to hear from others whether this is just a marketing site or a real movement. Sorry Indy, I am on board for 2008 if my health and economic well being make it that long.

Posted by: Ira | December 17, 2004 01:01 PM

Ira,

It's evidently an independent, non official website set up by a supporter. I fell there is a strong movement of supporters that hope to have JK run again and will continue to support him.

One of my vendors was just here for a delivery and he asked me, "will Kerry run again... I said, "I hope and believe he will"... his reply was "GOOD, because we will still need him and he is still the best man for the job!"

I attack no one. I simply state an opinion and the facts that Kerry has not championed this cause, but ridden in on the coat-tails of the Third Party Candidates.

And I am not inspired to fight for my Nation, my freedoms and the freedoms and Natural Rights of all of humanity by ONE MAN, so get off the Idol worship, and get on with what you feel you have to do.

Kerry has NOT been leading anything. He has been following the lead of others bold and courageous enough to actually DO SOMETHING.

Had the Third Party Candidates not rallied and spoken out by filing recounts, Kerry would be no where near any of this, and IF...and that is a BIG IF...IF Kerry is about to prosecute the biggest case of fraud and treason against the American People in our Nation's history, then I'll eat my words and gratefully so, but until then, my opinion stands.

As for his running for anything in the future...it will all hinge on the outcome of the next month, and should he be called to lead because the Ohio Recount shows Kerry to be the clear winner, then what? Will he fight or cower as Al Gore did?

I see no leadership. Especially from those who would proclaim to be the right leader for this Nation at the right time.

The Founding Fathers risked and some LOST their lives fighting for this burgeoning Democracy, and all that has been portrayed of our sniveling Representatives in Washington, D.C. is a group of disconnected, ineffective, pandering politicians who are more concerned with K-Street bribes and retaining the power and prestige of their posts than the true purpose of their elected status...to speak for the People.

The PEOPLE are angry. The People want EVERY VOTE COUNTED. The People asked for LEADERSHIP but instead received concession and retreat.

I am BADGERING, BATING and BEGGING for John Kerry to prove me wrong, until then, he is just another politician doing the Potomac Two-Step at the cost of Liberty, Democracy and the Blood, Sweat and Tears of the American People.

Sorry if you cannot handle rational and logical dissent...too bad actually, for no Revolution of thought or conscience was ever won by blind-faith in spineless fools or believing in ghosts...

Action/In-action...it is up to John Kerry to PROVE he is not another wanna-be, and so far, I have seen no proof of REAL action.

Joe Conyers is the only one I have seen sticking his precious neck out for the People, and when I SEE Kerry do so, I'll believe it, until then...

Instead of No Retreat, No Surrender...Kerry will feel the bite of No Regrets but No Support...and THAT you can be certain of no matter how much you worship the Man.

The Sunshine Patriot and Summer Soldier need not apply for the Presidency...the American People have too long suffered at the trembling hands and greedy bank accounts of tyrants...

Do not try to deify the Man...he either has the Right Stuff, or he does not and can join the ranks of Al Gore and the lot of Kerry Advisors who have shown they have not the courage, whits nor fortitude to do the one thing they have promised to all...

Lead.

I am speechless after reading this story today:

Shooting Allegedly Staged to Avoid Returning to Iraq

Fri Dec 17, 7:55 AM ET Top Stories - Los Angeles Times
By David Zucchino Times Staff Writer

PHILADELPHIA — A U.S. Army combat veteran on leave from a unit headed back to Iraq arranged for a friend to shoot him in the leg in an attempt to avoid returning to the war zone, Philadelphia police said Thursday.

Spc. Marquise Roberts, 23, told police he had been shot Tuesday afternoon as he walked past two men arguing on a North Philadelphia street. But police said their investigation found that Roberts actually was shot once in the leg by a friend as part of a scheme to avoid returning to Iraq.

Roberts, who served seven months in Iraq during the U.S. invasion in 2003, was due to report back to Ft. Stewart, Ga., on Wednesday, police said. He is a supply specialist with the Army's 3rd Infantry Division (Mechanized), according to commanders at Ft. Stewart. They said Roberts, who has been in the Army since 2001, was on a two-week holiday leave to his home in Philadelphia.

The division, which helped topple the Saddam Hussein regime in Baghdad in April 2003, has been ordered to begin heading back to Iraq next month. Roberts had returned from Iraq in midsummer 2003.
~~continue~~
http://tinyurl.com/426qo

Indy

You could learn a few things from your own preaching, if you simply stopped spouting sometimes.

Your point was made on the post below, reposting it hear you become a broken a record!

I'm one person on this Blog who will not deify, Indy!

We're all entitled to our opinions and A LOT of people on this Blog believe in John Kerry. You insult everyone here who does with your rant against him.

Indy:

Just as I informed you last summer when you visciously attacked me for telling you we weren't going to carry Texas, lighten up, we lost and nothing in Ohio is going to change that. I just signed the recount petition but it is spitting in the wind and whteher Kerry gets involved with it or not changes nothing in my mind.

Does that mean we should give up our futures. No, it only means that the 2004 election is in the past. Whether you want to support Kerry, Gore or go to a third part that is perfectly fine with me. My butt was getting cold along with hundreds of us from Austin and Houston in Denver working tirelessly for Kerry. I looked for you man and didn't see you. That was your choice. I know that everyone here thinks of you as a god, I don't see it quite that way.

Kerry was outfront on opposing the prescription drug bill and is currently working with Ted kennedy against the Social Security reform. I know that you are smarter than him and know what is best but personally I trust his political judgement much more than your ragging on his campaign telling him constantly that he needed to spend more time in Texas.

Pamela...I won't even respond to that childishness.

Ira, No deity here at all, never pretended to be...never asked to be anything but who I am...I speak my mind...why is that such an odd occurance?

Because we have been taught NOT to speak up? Because we have been taught to stand in line? Because, as of late, we have been TOLD with the threat of imprisonment not to condemn OUR elected (or appointed) leaders?

I am not running for President, nor are the statement of my opinions any less valid or more potent than anyone elses, but at least I speak out and speak up, you have every right to disagree.

Ira, has ANY of the PROVEN evoting fraud been tried in Texas? Did you hear a peep? A Whine? A Whimper? Why was News 8 Austin (the most insignificant station here)the ONLY station to cover the fact that in early voting the machines were SEEN, VIEWED, WATCHED switching votes from Kerry to Bush and yet NOTHING was done?

It was and remains my firm belief that if Kerry would have made a swing through Texas it would have an effect upon the outcome, but the Kerry Advisors thought otherwise. I am like everyone else in wishing to actually see and hear first hand what representation I am voting for as is my right as an American citizen, or should I lessen that classification since I am not registered with the Invisible DNC?

Screw that, I am an American first and foremost and all of the partisan crap that you people so easily fall for and become distracted by is unbelievable.

If any of you want to throw your daggers at me, go right ahead, you cannot hurt me with your words, but I would cherish some good old fashioned insight and LEADERSHIP from those who have given their WORD they would lead...and lead us to victory...not a retreat into obscurity and lack of credibility.

That is where my interests are kept and that is where they remain, not in the lies and pandering of the DNC, RNC or any other money grubbing organization that says one thing and does another only to fill the pockets of their most cherished contributors...last I checked the Constitution states that the Government of our Nation is to serve the people, not enslave them into endentured servitude by removing the Peoples rights to fair elections, affordable Health-care, education, equal rights, no taxation without representation, freedom of (and from ) religion, fair wages for a days work, life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness...not spending all of our time trying to chase down which criminal in Washington is robbing what social program blind while smiling, smirking or otherwise promising the world is our oyster.

And if you are afraid of comments and dissent, even in my vicious and evil Indy ways, tough, I will stand up for my Nation as I see fit, and I am only biding my time until January 20th rolls around to see if any REAL action is taken by the Servants of the People, as they are the ones with the connections, control, and power to actually attempt to right this travesty of justice and democracy...and if they do not you can dream happy dreams of 2006, but they will never come to fruition, for if this witch hunt is not successful, we can bend down, kneel on the ground and kiss America good-bye.

So once again the People are the ONLY and LAST means of defense of our Constitution than so be it...I'll see you all on the Battle Fields or I'll see you all in Hell.

We will not allow this dicussion to run off into futile argiung and name-calling; it is too important.

This election is rapidly being revealed as 2000 redux. Whether the revelations coming out again and again will have a more efficacious effect this time remains to be seen. But WE have seen the truth.

Remember how often on the Blog we would all have the same WTF response to media reports? We would have first-hand reports on events that would be misrepresented or not covered at all. We had a collective experience that was denied.

When Dick and I went to the Common Cause event, we could not help but notice that all the incidents reported were not new to us, as they appeared to be to many. You all reported them here, and in the irc.

So we do have a responsibility to hang together and get the truth out, even if it does not end the way some of us would have it.

Personally, I am not thinking about 2008 at all. I am not even thinking about 2006 yet. Or the DNC Chair race. I am interested in making sure that the truth is revealed, that the battles are fought to assure this NEVER happens again, that the media pays a price for their deceptions, and that democracy is understood and restored.

In order to do that, we absolutely need to remember that we are fellow infantry, and we do not shoot at each other.

What we DO is stay focused, share information, support and get behind each other. We build teams and take on roles.

No surrender, remember?

So chill out everyone, the enemy is nearby and we need to get ready for the next battle.

Posted by: Karen | December 17, 2004 02:15 PM

Karen

It's pointless at this point for ANYONE to attack JK.

We all have a stake in what is happening in this country and we are all doing what we feel we can do best to change things.

We all worked hard for JK and some of us simply can't stand by while others attack him.

Kerry & Kennedy rock!
I will vote for the Dem in 2008 - I will decide later what else I'll do to prep.
US foreign policy has been flawed for decades & the Republicans have been trying to take down New Deal programs since they were established. One individual or party can not "fix" it.

Meanwhile in WA - I have no choice but to spend the weekend phone banking & observing ballot counting, because:

http://www.comcast.net/News/GENERAL//XML/1134_Gubernatorial/06533d17-190b-46a0-95b2-2e04d343be4b.html

Indy: " has ANY of the PROVEN evoting fraud been tried in Texas? Did you hear a peep? A Whine? A Whimper? Why was News 8 Austin (the most insignificant station here)the ONLY station to cover the fact that in early voting the machines were SEEN, VIEWED, WATCHED switching votes from Kerry to Bush and yet NOTHING was done?

It was and remains my firm belief that if Kerry would have made a swing through Texas it would have an effect upon the outcome, but the Kerry Advisors thought otherwise."

Yea Indy you heard a peep. I spoke with Harris County Clerk, gave you her email address, Jerry Birnberg the Harris Cty Chair and the ALCU's names and phone numbers, the cause number regarding the Kingwood clerk's discouraging of early voting applications. This clerk was fired and suit is pending by the ACLU. I told you all of these specifics 'in detail' so how do you now post that nothing was being done. Richard Murray had Bush ahead by 26% points here in Texas when you posted bs thatKerry was w/i 5% .I believe Bush won Texas by 20% points. I told you that you were insane expecting Kerry to waste one minute here in Texas. I went to his March 2004 gathering at Houston Community college west and was up on the stage with him but didn't want nor expect him here again.

Again Indy there were 4 busloads of volunteers that I helped co-ordinate from Austin and would be happy to share their names with you who came to cold Colorado. Where the hell were you my friend.

Your prose are great but don't put yourself ou there like some kind of a god and tell the rest of us how wrong we are. Personally other than your rants on the blog and getting your picture taken with Teresa I didn't see one other contribution from you during the 18 months I worked my butt off for Kerry.

Personally if you want to back LaRouche or Nader next time I don't think any of us here will lose sleep over it.

You are right its a free world out there, but I don't think we are interested in a bunch of bs.

Indy

What you write makes me think of what my husband is expressing. It's not fair.
We are not seeing justice. We can identify fraud, media lying, corruption but we have no immediate or even short-to-medium way to get justice. I agree to that.

When someone speaks out, there is an attempt to crucify them. Conyers & the black Congressional caucus & 3rd parties are ignored by the system. Someone like Kerry would get the Kafi Annan treatment.
The world respects Annan & the UN & defends them - the US Repub admin doesn't so they trash him. Why? He pointed out that the Iraq war is internationally illegal.

If I knew what the solution is I would advocate for it. I don't. All I can do at this point is study it, keep informed, get info out & work locally. I assume many in the Senate are working behind the scenes. High profile? Like I said, they get crucified. Political suicide. Are they afraid. Maybe.

Think about what just happened to Yushenko. It isn't pretty.

The St. Louis Post-Dispatch reports that the Swift Boat Liars plan to continue their attacks even though the election is over.

Further information and comments at the Unofficial Kerry Blog:
http://kerryblog.blogspot.com

Reading the posts today reminds me of Pogo: "We have met the enemy . . . and he is us."

Fighting each other, re-hashing old differences gets us nowhere. I, for one, would rather see us focus on what brings us together here, and thie work we need to be doing now.

Our country is in crisis, and we cannot afford to be distracted from the tasks at hand.

I continue to believe in John Kerry.
I supported him 100%, with eyes-wide-open...I do not make heroes out of mortal men. I think JK had the potential to become a great president, and this country lost an opportunity to go in a new direction on Nov. 2. That makes me sad for what "might have been"....but this is no time to give up.
It has been reported that JK will go on a fact-finding trip to Iraq and the middle-East in a few weeks. Sen. Joe Biden just returned from Iraq, ditto Sen. Carl Levin. When Congress returns on Jan.4, I expect to see these 3 Senators lead the way, stepping up to every live microphone they can find. I want to see & hear them on TV and in print news, turning full fury against the criminality of the Bush administration. I want to witness some outrage coming from the halls of Congress, against what the Republicans are doing to this country, all in the name of corporate greed.
Its time we take the blinders off of 51% of Americans who continue to NOT hold Bush accountable. No more words like "Bush mislead"....I want to hear "Bush LIED".
I'm hoping we see a new fighting spirit from the Democrats returning to Congress. Once the new Congress is in session, I expect to hear loud & clear, Democratic opposition to Bush's agenda...if its business as usual, and they allow Bush to plunder this country for another 4 years without challenging Bush on every point, then I WILL give up on John Kerry and Joe Biden, et al.

More for anyone following my pet cause (WA gubanatorial race which can decide whether I have a job):

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/204162_governor17.html

I realize there are only 50 Governors & this case sets important precedents, but it helps motivate me to also have a personal reason to fight!

Dino Rossi would cut 46,000 poor children off health care & is a friend of big business.

Ira - I'm seeing more on healthcare/AARP, another worthy battle.

Ron

The swfit boat guys are financed by Perry Homes here in Texas. If there could only be some organized boycott of their homes by Texas Dems.

This blog sounds like Guardian Talk today only the accents are Texan rather than British.

Pamela,
Thanks a lot for posting what Kerry has been doing. I speak more kindly of him since the election. I don’t know if Indy’s point about not responding until third party participation is valid or not. Was the Kerry campaign about ready to respond when the third parties went forward? They seemed to be well organized so it may just be timing. I believe Kerry’s brother was working on it before the announcement. I don’t know.

You are correct saying his cannot be the voice or it will sound like sour grapes.
The voices should be the congressional and party leaders:
Pelosi, Reid, and the heads of the DLC/DNC are the voices of our party. The attack on Bush should be withering. He is flat lying about the economy and SS without a public challenge from our side.
I don't find fault with Kerry. I find fault with the party leadership. That is also true of the election but that is another discussion. I am very angry about the free ride Bush is getting from our party leadership. It seems like they want to fly below the radar when BushCo is monopolizing the media.

Silence is not golden.

I don't think the Gore slams are justified. If I remember correctly, the nine Supremes stopped the vote count. Gore resisted enormous pressure to throw in the towel early “for the good of the country”.

I understand the emphasis is on the vote count and vote fraud and that is getting most of the party attention. This is the most important issue. But events are proceeding onward and we must keep the attack moving.

There are a lot of powerful Dems that should get involved that are not in Congress.
Gore, Jesse, Sharpton and Dean, just to name a few, should be all over Bush pounding him on issues. Those who may want future power or attention should consider the cost of silence. We will remember those who are sitting on the sidelines now when they want to be players later.

Posted by: Ira | December 17, 2004 02:33 PM

Like I said IRA, sticks and stones...and because I did not go on your noble little bus ride does not mean I have not been committed to other causes or in supporting John Kerry during the campaign reaching people who the Texas Democrats and Vote for Change could not. I was able to convince in person and online many who had never voted in their lives to get registered and have their voices heard. It was impossible for me to leave Austin at the time you went so please save your judgment for a critique of your next meal, you know nothing of my situation or what sacrifices I have made to work with and for the campaign so if you want to vent go ahead, as previously stated your insults mean nothing.

The fact that my writing reached and touched thousands around the world (yes I get email from all over the world) was not my way of glorifying anything but my Nation and the principles and doctrines I was raised to believe meant something not only to Americans but to all citizens of the world.

What is with this "god" crap? I am certainly not pretending to be anyone other than who my passion would lead you to believe I am, as an American. I am even more intense in person. Deal with it or don't that is your choice Brother.

For the record Ira, I never supported Nader...he was a great public watchdog but in my opinion does not have the vision or insight to be President of the United States.

I have been an Independent all of my life, even before registering to vote when I filled out my selective service card. My family are all Republicans (or Southern Democrats...and you know what that means in Louisiana) As far as the Democratic party, though I agree with much of the ideology, I do not blindly follow any one party or any one set of values...I believe in the Principles and Doctrines of the Constitution and have become ever so fond of the Declaration of Independence as of late for it may just fortell the course of our future action as a People to free our Nation from this tyranny.

But if you wish to vent and displace, and project your anger at me, please do, I am here for you Ira whether you wish to rant and rage at me, or discuss policy in action...thus are the sweet and bitter fruits of a democracy. We do not have to agree on every lick of policy or ideology but we can instead agree to disagree and accept each others veried and diverse opinions...we would not want to end up like the Neocons now would we? Good so let's not act like them.

Bob Evans,
As I recounted on the old Kerry blog, my job was to make sure Manila bars did not close because of a lack of business. My liver has recovered and if they need a good drinker, I am ready for them.

I will be 58 soon and if they continue drafting seniors they will need a few special items for Bush’s new army:
Walkers, Depends, false teeth cleaner, Metamucil and contact lens cleaner to name a few. The eyes aren’t too good so everything must be in large print. And lots of afternoon naps are needed. Seniors go to bed early so no nighttime actions are possible. No spicy food is allowed. We are hard of hearing so shouting is necessary. Sometimes seniors get confused so no complicated directions. No dangling chads are allowed. We aren't as spry anymore so no quick movements please.

Battlebob --

LOL!! The spirit is willing, but . . .

I am really out of shape, myself. I'll have to do more peace marches to get ready for re-induction!

Bob Evans,
As long as the marches are short, the signs are light, and the temperature is moderate, I can do it.

"noble little bus ride" Right Indy. You are so full of yourself and self promotion it sickens me to associate this party with you. You are right I know nothing about you nor you of the hardships my family, and hundreds of others I worked with that left their families, their jobs and businesses many,many single moms left their young children to help, many across the country and from Austin to what you claim was yes a little 36 hour bus trip. Right Indy it was all just a lot of fun and games and we spent 15 hour days singing cumba ya. I will make sure that next election our candidate knows that Indy said that our little bus trips and phone banking were just feel good times and that Indy reached thousands across the world pontificating. You are a true waste of any campaign's time and energy into self promotion and glorification and yes WHINING.

Personal attacks are NOT appropriate on this blog.

Either kiss and make up, boys, or take it somewhere else. This is a place to work TOGETHER.

hey guys!

i've been very busy lately so i havent had a chance get on here in a while. :-( ...but now i had a chance so i thought id stop by... and add to the "texas accents" ;-) (even though i really dont have a texas accent)

Pamela- i just wanted to thank you for what you do on your blog to bring us info about what JK is up to. He changed my life and so no matter what... i will always believe in him. BUT...

...at the same time, i hear what Indy says and i realize that i need to remember that (to quote John Kerry himself in 1971) "This is not the struggle of one day, or one month, or one year...It’s a struggle and an effort, and a sacrifice, and a contribution which we make for the rest of our lives."

I will always love Kerry, soon he will be my senator, and i will support him if he decides to run again for president. but i think its important to remember that this isnt really about him, or about whoever the Democratic candidate in '08 is... its about US.

"For me, a few hours ago, this campaign came to an end. But for those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die." ~Ted Kennedy, 1980

It's through US that the work will go on and the dream will never die.

...just my 2 cents... great to be back! :-)

Posted by: Ira | December 17, 2004 03:16 PM

As I said Ira, you are entitled to your opinion, and I am glad you could get that off your chest...feel better?

You can call me whatever you like and make whatever judgements you choose, it is a free country, but what I write comes from my heart and from my belief in this Nation and has nothing to do with self-promotion nor am I concered about your singular opinion, but in all opinions.

And you are just proving my point...it is difficult to think and act as an American when one is segregated by party, race or creed is it not?

That is the oldest divisive tactic in the book of man's inhumanity to man...divide and conquer.

So be divided and segregate yourself from your allies and those who would fight your battles with you, as I said sounds more and more like the Neocons...and what they truly want...implosion of the support for change in America...the silencing of all voices of dissent.

There is work to do before January 6th, and much more to do if this is not rectified before the electoral votes are cast, so if you are done with impailing me on your self-righteous spear of elitism...

I talk of Unity in America and of Americans fighting for the fundamental principles this Nation which are to protect the natural rights of all, I tell no one what to believe or how to act...that would be, well...Un-American.

If that is self-promotion and worthlessness and it gets one person to think about what their responsibilities and duties are as an American, then I am one self-promoting worthless son of a bitch...and happily, patriotically so...

Have a great day Ira!!!

I have read all of the posts in today's thread. At the risk of having my head bashed in, I have some thoughts:

For myself, all I can say is the first time I visited the JK blog it was Indy's writings and diagrams that got me excited about participating in the campaign. But, it went beyond that. There were so many others who were equally passionate, but maybe not as eloquent. I did not think any less of their contributions nor comments.

I don't know what the right answer is about the voting issue. I too am disappointed that I have not heard more from JK about this awful scandal. Yet, politics is a nasty cut throat game. Is it that John Kerry is trying to stay alive to fight for those principles he believes in? Would it be best if he was leading the charge and would he have to fall on his sword over the voting issue? Would it be best if others took the lead?

Before we start slamming each other. Let's look at who we really have to be angry with. Are they looking us in the mirror? I don't think so. We all contributed in the best way we knew or possibly could.

Personally, I hold the DNC responsible for the majority of the problems that we are now facing. The DNC was satisfied to coast on Bill Clinton's charisma. They dropped the ball and left us with this stinking pile of crap to deal with.

Stand up to the Kerry bashing on DU and vote in this poll:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1437369#1437434

Ron,
you must be registered before the poll was started to be eligible. No new walk-ins allowed.

Last I read, only about 1/3 of Democrats even know about a voting scandal.

the new wedge issue

Rove must be laughing.
I find it uninteresting to attack Dems or their candidates. They may not always be perfect or inspiring but certainly not the enemy.

Great post Suz. We need a whole pack of folks howling and watching the government. Like bloodhounds. Or like hawks--"Watch em like a hawk". It is imperative for democracy.

Also, this is a very fitting topic for today, because tonight is Bill Moyers' last broadcast I think, and it is on the topic of media consolidation. Media consolidation certainly affects how we are able (or not able) to watch our government.

Last I read, only about 1/3 of Democrats even know about a voting scandal.

Posted by: DiAnne | December 17, 2004 04:00 PM

DiAnne,

So True. You wouldn't believe how many fellow Democrats get a puzzled look on their face when I bring this issue up with them. DCP's goal of changing media coverage related to issues such as this are of paramount importance.

DiAnne,
We were questioning Kerry’s activities until election day.
Vote fraud is taking precedent over anything else - as it should. My problems are:
1 – There is no Democratic response to Bush’s horrible agenda that seems to be sailing along with no opposition from Democrats. The party leadership is silent. The press will not respond until prominent Dems start responding.
2 – The trivial election analysis performed by the DLC. Blaming Michael Moore for the defeat is absurd. We need more Michael Moores. The circular firing squad is in force with weapons loaded.
3 – I question whether Sen. Reid and Tim Roemer are the correct people. I am not a big Reid fan. I don’t know a thing about Tim Roemer except what is on the net.
Try these on for size. Some of his votes I agree with and some I don’t. I could say that about any Congressman.

http://www.issues2000.org/IN/Tim_Roemer.htm

...i'm not a big Reid fan, either, but i dont know that much on him... what are other people's oppinions of Reid?

This article talks about how the conservatives hate government and want to kill social security.

http://www.rockridgeinstitute.org/research/block/pessimism

Here is a short synopsis about Harry Reid..

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/11/16/104545/32

[snip]
Reid, a Mormon from tiny Searchlight, Nev., lacks Daschle's flair as a speaker and public figure and rarely goes on TV outside his home state. Moreover, he gets along well with Republican leaders and has parted company with most Democratic lawmakers on some prominent issues, such as his support for a constitutional ban on flag burning and his opposition to abortion in most cases [...]

Indy-

You are breaking my heart. What happened to you? Are you going through the "anger" phase of grieving? You were such a strong supporter. You were the one who spent countless hours trying to convince me that Kerry WAS looking into the voting issues in Ohio, when I was having doubts and fears. You reminded me that he was being careful in his approach, so as not to threaten the investigation. Remember what we talked about? How he is a prosecuting attorney who knows better than to scream accusations from the rafters without all the evidence being weighed. Why are you suddenly so negative?

*sniff*

well bloggers,

today seems to be the day of strong debate and varying views. in a way i am proud that there is plenty of shouting and hollering in all of you. it makes me feel like all the heat in me is not orphaned and alone.

however, i take exception to any personal attacks made by anyone for any reason. we know each other thru one topis only, politcis. that is not enough for any of us to make blanket judgments about another. i subscribe to the ideal that judgment is not my right, nor am i good enough to judge another person.

no matter what we say about the kerry blog, it was a magnetic meeting place that all of us were devoted to. we were there night and day, and throwing encouragment and good will to every corner of our universe. it was a good thing, to be remembered fondly, sadly now to be put away.

we have a gold mine of fine minds and good organizers and writers and sincere hearts. we love this country. above and beyond loving any politician we love our beautiful land. that is as it should be.

will john kerry or any politician jump to our tune? not until we refine a tune and grow in number so that we cannot be ignored. we grow in number by bringing more and more people into the light. at this point, it does not matter how we increase the number of people who are willing to fight for democracy, what matters is that we turn over every rock, and drive down every road to find them.

there is no requirement for us to have a mutual admiration society here, and debate is good. can't any of you admit that some of your posts are made while feeling a pang of grief, or a spike of bitter anger at how things have turned out so far? it does hurt, and we are humans putting out emotions out there in cyberspace for all to see. geez, a little protection and commiseration won't kill any of us.

finally, as to john kerry. i would not have gone down the road that has made the man what he is. i respect it, i am grateful that he put himself out there and did his best. he took every blow and kept going. if it didn't work, now is not the time to kick him. recognize that his humanity is as worthwile as all of ours. accept that for whatever reasons he takes the actions he takes, he is not quitting on us or anyone.

the page has turned. it is time to move on with the story. i don't want it written for us, i want to be an author. i'd like to think that there is an end to this journey, and it would be less sweet if any of us do not make the trip to its sunset.

am ia asking too much or expecting too much from any of you, if i ask to be respected, borne up, encouraged or comforted? because i am here to do the same for all of you.

Native Texan..

As first glance, they sound Republican lite.
Right now, they are invisible.

Posted by: tutterfly | December 17, 2004 05:07 PM

well said..
I think there will be struggles until the Dem party figures out its direction and has a voice.
Opposition parties oppose.
If you don't oppose, you agree.
Silence says agree.

Changing the subject...
We had to register and log in on the old blog.
Part of the registration was a email address.
Could someone from this site contact all those who registered on the old site and invite them here?
We had thousands of supporters and why start all over again?

Tutter,

Hear, hear! You're still doing a good job planting those seeds, brother. Thanks for being there.

All:
I was saddened by much of what I read in this thread. Understanding and empathizing with what everyone was saying, but saddened nevertheless. It all relates to something discussed in an earlier thread, the analogy with the stages of grief. I see my own frustration, the inability to fully accept what has happened, the way I follow what is happening in Ohio wherever I can though rationally I am 99% sure it will not make a difference (not in the election results, but hopefully in bringing stinking dirt to the surface, let the whole world see it, smell it, and understand what has most probably taken place, and then … who knows?), the gut desire to see Kerry take a more active part, while at the same time realizing that for a variety of reasons he might be actually right in staying in the background, the way I feel like screaming at the TV (and I sometimes actually do it) when I hear some other nonsensical, discouraging, infuriating, outrageous piece of news or see Bush’s maddening and pathetic smirk, the way I wish for somebody out there, somebody with a bigger voice that can be heard and have an impact to just stand up and SCREAM against all this absurdity, for somebody to just DO something. And all I did prior to the election was to follow the news and keep my fingers crossed (and yes, I do feel BAD about doing nothing)! And I cannot even begin to imagine how the way I feel must be amplified in the people whose thoughts I read here, who put so much time, effort, and heart into the campaign. It is too early, after such pain and loss, to be objective and fully rational about it all. Please, keep this in mind.

um, bob evans---

thanks, (and tutterfly is a girl)

i remain your devoted sister.

haha

Posted by: Irina | December 17, 2004 05:42 PM

Bark like dogs and howl.

For years our government was USED to hiding behind the closed doors of their "lofty" goals, and we could trust the press to sniff them out and howl at the stench of it all.

Since they can't be relied upon, it's up to US here to howl til our voices arre hoarse and bite at the heels of the press and our government representatives.

It's a lot easier to ignore a sleeping dog than one that is making a rukus!!!

Ha ha. Actually, I knew that, just wasn't thinking.

"i don't want it written for us, i want to be an author."
Posted by: tutterfly | December 17, 2004 05:07 PM

I definitely want to riff off of tutterfly's comment here, because I think she is striking at the heart of a core issue. One of the things that was a little different about the K-E Blog is that is was not lead by any one voice. Voices came and went, and if those voices were strong and decisive and credible, those writers became leaders, and influenced others.

So many of us found our sense of language, passion, cajones, and role on the Blog. Most had never been involved in politics before, at least not in an active way. But so many became authors, not just of the words written, but authors of our lives.

In that sense, when Ira could not go to Ohio, he went to Colorado. Indy jumped in a car one day and drove hundreds of miles to see Teresa. We crashed Hollywood parties, wrote countless letters to the editors, collared our friends, in short--we made a difference.

Toward the end of the campaign, I told a story--the starfish story--about a young man walking on a beach where thousands of starfish had been thrown up in a storm. He is throwing them back into the water, one by one. Someone says to him: "Why are you bothering? There are so many. You can't possibly make a difference." The young man picks up a starfish and throws it back in and says to the person: "I just made a difference to THAT one."

An author is more than a person who strings words together. An author is someone who takes responsibility for creating language that has an effect, who makes an impact, who compels one to act.

I am asking each one of us to become authors--to write in ways that influence and change hearts and minds; that inspires action.

In November 2004, as a result of so many empowered voters, at least 3 million more people voted for John Kerry that had ever voted for a Democratic candidate before. That's a lot of starfish, IMO.

Next goals: the media and voting transparency. We are needed.

Suz,

This is an awesome thread header and terrific reminder that we need to "bark" louder and longer at any seeming misdeeds until they're resolved / stopped / prevented. Thanks for sharing with us.

Posted by: battlebob | December 17, 2004 05:19 PM

Hi Battlebob:

That is a great idea. We are in the process of making a switch to a better running program, but you're right--we have no intention of inventing the wheel--and we'll get them back asap!

Posted by: dwahzon | December 17, 2004 05:53 PM

Dw--

Thanks.

If you hear any howling at 6:00 pm, it's because I've just got done howling at CNN-who's next?

They have an answering machine even on weekends, and I intend to bark up a storm(

Need more work with white males & married women

Women voters are the majority of the electorate, and most likely to give the majority of their votes to Democratic candidates.

54 percent of voters on November 2, 2004 were women.
Women gave John Kerry a majority of their votes: 51 percent Kerry, 48 percent Bush (Men voted for Bush 55 percent - 44 percent).
Subgroups of women voters are particularly important to Democrats.

African American women gave John Kerry more than 90 percent of their vote.
Single women voted for John Kerry 62 percent - 37 percent.
Young women (18-29 years old) voted for John Kerry 56 percent - 43 percent.

Tutter,

As always, your insights help to calm stormy waters. Could you please grab some influential politician or reputable newsperson and sit him/her down for a good talking to? We need for them to know what in the h... is really going on out here.
-------------------------------------------------
When the DNC sent out their post election survey. I honestly filled mine out. I suggested they had lost touch with their constituency, did not have a firm grasp on the issues that concerned the electorate, and were hell bent on making the economy the main issue-when it was clear that the country was more focused on the war, and terrorism.

Again they are not listening to their core constituency. All of us are upset about the Ohio election disaster, and expect some action on their part to make the issue more prominent in the public eye. This has to be done before and not after January 20. If they don't show the courage to bring this issue to the forefront, I will remain profoundly disappointed.

If the logic is to weaken George Bush after the inauguration, that would be a totally illogical approach. Country first before politics.

Posted by: Irina | December 17, 2004 05:42 PM

Don't think that our anger is all entirely do to the sadness of not winning.

Bush decided he has a mandate and unless there is outrage from the Dems, he will get it. The press will do nothing until the Dems speak out.

This is actually smart strategy by Bushco. If your opposition is doing nothing, fill in the void with action. Look, even though I spent my military service in a drunken stupor I learned two things:
1 – I am a pretty good engineer drunk and a damn good one sober. I have been sober since my plane left Clark AFB in late 1968.
2 – If you aren’t on the offense, you are playing defense. There is no middle ground.

I understand and accept that Kerry’s role must be behind the scenes and that he is concentrating on voter fraud. The rest of the Dem party is huddled in the corner allowing Bushco to rape, pillage and plunder anywhere he wants. Silence is acceptance.

we have a gold mine of fine minds and good organizers and writers and sincere hearts. we love this country. above and beyond loving any politician we love our beautiful land. that is as it should be.

Posted by: tutterfly | December 17, 2004 05:07 PM

Tutterfly:

You are a wonderful author and a terrific representative for the work for justice we have created as our mission on the dcp! We HAVE done this because each of us here understands the idea of democracy and each of us have a commitment to our fellow Americans and to the world.

We are full of passion and sincerity. And because of this, we WILL learn how to pull together and overcome the he corruption in the government and the media.

We will become stronger and then when we do--PEOPLE will know that in America the little guy can rail against corruption and bring about the true Democracy we deserve.

A little evening light reading...
And this is from the group that preaches morality..

From the Rights & Liberties News Log:
With new evidence from both the ACLU Freedom of Information Act
request and a 30-year army veteran discharged for questioning
the torture of prisoners, there's no denying the torture of
Iraqi prisoners was both systematic and headquarters-approved.
Is it any wonder that former Department of Homeland
Security nominee Bernie Kerik's nanny problems were a welcome
distraction? Too bad they weren't the real problem.
http://www.alternet.org/rights/log/

INSULT TO INJURY
David Phinney, CorpWatch
Add rancid meat and food crawling with bugs to the list of
appalling conditions that Abu Ghraib prisoners were subject
to.
http://www.alternet.org/rights/20778/

Posted by: battlebob | December 17, 2004 06:08 PM

100% agree with your "silence is acceptance" statement.

My comments were simply about what I think is a natural process when something hits you hard. Everybody reacts differently, but everybody reacts.

But there is a bit of action, isn't there? A BIT, but still... The holiday season does not help either. I keep hoping that all hell will break lose in January, or at least SOME hell will break lose...

Suz, excellent thread. At the end of the day, I just cannot believe the message Big Media is putting out there. Thankfully we have the Internet, and people on blogs like this one to help sort out fact from fiction.

hey all--check this out!

MoveOn.org Accepts Sinclair Challenge: "We'll gladly send an email with a Sinclair message"
In the news

Baltimore's Daily Record: MD's ad industry warns anti-Sinclair campaign could be costly
PR Week: Sinclair embracing publicity stemming from Media Matters attacks
Raleigh News and Observer:Protest

http://sinclairaction.com/

Don't forget on the right sidebar are other links--this one came from the media watch!

i have not said 'beautiful bloggers' for a while now. we are quite spiffy i think. really a handsome, entertaining, eloquent, educated bunch. you could not ask for a more lively get together than one of ours.

if my little house could cram you all in, i would have one swinging party.

we are winners, every one of us, because nothing, and no one is going to put us out as yesterdays news. we aren't hiding. we aren't going away.

the party is going to need us, just like we need them to represent us. never again will the party have to look for us, because our mission is to get in their face.

growling bloggers are the best kind.
grrrrrrrrrrr

Posted by: Irina | December 17, 2004 06:17 PM

I meant no insult...
Bush's main thrust is SS and tax reform. It is no accident he starts with them while Dems are either gone or cowering.

I am most digusted with Reid, Pelosi, Toemer and the second tier of Dems that have nothing lose by trying to stop the madness - Gore, Dean, Clark, Edwards (who is probably working with Kerry), Sharpton....

Is this the new Dem party; go along to get along?

I was hoping for a Sharpton response to Rumsfeld.

"The largest owner of television stations in the country is now equating itself with an advocacy organization, rather than a media outlet," said David Brock, President and CEO of Media Matters for America. "This highlights a pattern we've seen with members of the conservative media attempting to draw false equivalencies in order to support their arguments. The real issue is that Sinclair Broadcast Group is abusing its stewardship of the public airwaves by not providing airtime for opposing viewpoints."
*************************************
The vehicle for this campaign is a new website, SinclairAction.com, where citizens can register concerns directly with companies that advertise on Sinclair stations. In just 48 hours, more than 51,000 people visited the site and sent approximately 18,000 emails to advertisers.

****************************************

POWER ALL!!! Write--call and nip at the heels of the powerful-illegitimate media.

THIS is how we can hold them accountable and show the world their hypocracy and take back our public airwaves!

i am flying now, to see one of my children win an academic acheivement award.

the evening is young. i hope to return later.

thank you all, for your kind words today, and thank you also for the strong ones. we need it all.

The FCC's Localism Task Force sent 2 commissioners to St. Paul last week, to get local feedback. It's amazing that 200 concerned citizens took their turn at the mic, and not one of them was in favor of giving more power to corporate media.

http://www.startribune.com/stories/484/5129607.html

Posted by: sparrow | December 17, 2004 06:25 PM

Please put that link in the 'Around the net section...

Thanks...

tutterfly:

Congrats! We'll see you back here tomorrow.

Everyone:

I encourage you to go to the mediamatters link and sinclair link. We need to write to the advertisers and pin Sinclair to the wall again. I spent today writing them...please join me in this task.

Mark:

Thanks for the link! And this is for any naysayers who think our barking is just noice! (from mark's link)

******************************************

Adelstein said he and his FCC ally Michael Copps felt like "lone voices in the wilderness" howling against the other commissioners and the big media companies.

But 3 million letters and e-mails to the FCC and Congress persuaded him that the public cared about the issue. And the judge who voided the rules cited those letters in his ruling.

----------------------------------------

NEW THREAD

----------------------------------------

Posted by: battlebob | December 17, 2004 06:24 PM
I meant no insult...

I know :-).

I am not sure Edwards sees himself as 2nd tier.

As for Sharpton, I was living in NY when his name first popped up in te news, and in a pretty ugly way. I don't like demagogues and manipulators, does not matter whose side they are on. He might have changed though, I don't know... He is definitely smart, articulate, and can give good in your face answers. I am still not sure I trust him, though, and wonder how many people do.

Any comments about my new senator, Obama? I was really transfixed by his convention speech. He either deserves an Oscar or some special prize for oratorical achievement or he is really something special.

Bloggers!!! Please!!! :-)

If you read the posts CAREFULLY, starting with the thread topic, the one thing that stands out (to me) is that we all speak our opinion, but some take the personal opinions of one person as an attack on themselves or at one or more of the others. Not quite so.....

Each person is "howling" (thanks for the term, Suz) in rage and in disappointment, because we see, more clearly than most people, what was lost in November. We lost the reality and the vision of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights as they were written over two centuries ago. What was NOT broken the repukes are trying to fix and we see the injustice of it all, and our disappointments run deep when the Democrats from our own states have sided with the repukes. On the old blog, we kept up on the issues, posted facts and figures and truth - and yes, our opinions, too (while we still have our First Amendment rights...) - and the repukes (and some, even most Dems, at times) never bothered to check us out, nor, when mainstream media did bother to tell the truth with facts and figures, even in passing, did the repukes listen or check things out as thoroughly as we did. So, yes; I think we all know what we lost, and we realize how much that is going to cost us in the long run - not just money, but in lost moral values as espoused by the BushCo administration with their illegal, immoral, and unethical "values." We all know our credibility with other countries is totally gone now, too. Like others, I believe Kerry conceded MUCH too soon. (Don't know if anyone else did, but I wrote letters before election day, and on election night, to the direct email address and literally begged that if the election was close for Kerry NOT to concede early, as Gore had, so my disappointment runs deeper than I can express.) If Kerry had turned into a Democratic (albeit more civilized in his communications) version of BushCo and loudly fought for us, as well as himself, and if his speaking out loudly had made our publicly-owned free airwaves, I suspect we might still be embroiled in recounts throughout the United States. But, that's 20/20 hindsight, and does no good at this point. I supported Kerry, but the concession much too soon - before ALL the votes were counted - hit me like a fist to the gut.

The two top aims of this blog are Media Reform and Voting Reform - or, maybe one could also label the aims as Media Responsibility (which is sorely lacking and has been for four years) and Voting Reform and Responsibility. Without mainstream media reforming themselves and being responsible enough to tell the American public the truth (whether we like the truth or not), however, we can howl until we're hoarse and no voting reform will be accomplished. We still need a way to get the attention of mainstream media. I posted the links to the suit being brought to Sinclair a couple of days ago, so our boycott of Sinclair did some good, and is continuing to have an effect. I believe if we boycott ALL of mainstream media advertisers we will have an effect in the long run. I've privately continued to boycott all of them, but that only means a few pennies of profit to any of them. An organized boycott of mainstream media and their advertisers by half the population of this country would have an economic impact. Money is the only thing those corporations understand.... I will continue to post links to sites that talk about media, media abuse and misuse, sins of omission on the part of media, media manipulation, and anything else that is foul about the current state of mainstream media in the United States. Mainstream media has disgusted me profoundly....

IMHO, when it comes to voting, there's nothing wrong with the simplest approach: paper ballots that can be hand-counted, even if a scanner is initially used. It's the paper trail that is able to be counted. Throw the danged e-voting machines in the recycle heap, and go back to the simplest approach to voting that can be recounted: paper ballots. I'll patiently wait for a recount, no matter how long it takes, as long as all the votes are counted, and only a paper ballot will serve that purpose. I'm still debating about whether I like the electoral college or not... I see advantages and disadvantages to keeping it and throwing it out and going for majority votes.... As a "sub-division" of Voting Reform, I wish other states had it as easy as this state, and people could register at the polling place, even on election day itself, with proper ID as proof of residence. True, most people register long before they go to the polls, and if they don't change residence their names are on a computer printout at the polling place itself, and all one needs to do is give one's name, show a driver's license or ID card, get handed a ballot and they go vote.... Or is that too simple??? (From what I read on the old K/E blog on links, and what I heard on mainstream media news, it seems some states have a voting registration process that is only rivaled by the confusion in the current medicaid system regarding prescription medications... truly mind-boggling.)

We each bring opinions to this blog (just as on the old K/E blog) from the different perspectives we have gained based on our personal experiences. We can see an "overview" of situations and bring those insights to each other by posting them on the blog, as well as the kaleidoscope of personal opinions and commentary. I can't tell you how valuable the insights of others have been to me!!! I get to see different perspectives of diverse issues from different people in different parts of the country from Hawaii, or Alaska, or Texas, or Massachusetts, or Pennsylvania, or Florida, or from around the world, such as France and Australia and Azerbaijan and everywhere else - and I live in the middle of all of the states. I do not want people to stop airing personal opinions on the blog, because I truly want to hear what other people think - I get to try to see things from different perspectives that I've not thought of before, and it gives me a chance to modify my own opinions, change my opinions, or it reinforces my opinions for or against issues, so I very much WANT the different opinions expressed, and it doesn't make a bit of difference whether I agree with those opinions or not - I want the diversity of opinion and respect people for expressing those opinions; please, please do not stop expressing the kaleidoscope of opinions so I can have input into how to modify, change, or reinforce my opinions...!!! It's the best of how the First Amendment works, and the First Amendment is currently my first love....

I Heart Freedom of Expression!!! :-)