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Secular and Spiritual
[Editors Note: Part of our ongoing Sunday series examining the intersection of religion and politics and its relationship to our present state of democracy, written exclusively for the DCP, by Matthew Carnicelli]
Battles between American freethinkers and religious traditionalists are nothing new in our nation’s history. What is new is that we’re witnessing the emergence of the next generation of freethinkers on the political scene. And their experience mirrors the journey of the Founders and Framers in several key ways. This group is best described as the “Spiritual Not Religious” or “Secular and Spiritual” bloc in American politics.
As I’ve tried to demonstrate in previous columns, the Founders and Framers were products of the Enlightenment era. Men like Thomas Jefferson, John Adams, George Washington, Benjamin Franklin and Thomas Paine were freethinkers, utterly consumed by the search for truth. They saw the intellectual objectivity required for the study of nature’s laws as the perfect antidote to the kind of religious and philosophical subjectivity that had gripped European society in the post-Reformation world and caused it to bleed again and again.
The Secular and Spiritual movement reflects that same passion for independent thought. Emerging in an America that exists as an integral part of a modern global village, adherents to this school of thought are confronted with a much wider array of ideas than were the Founding Generation, or any previous generation of Americans. Consequently, they find it impossible to blindly accept the ideology of any school of thought.
Whereas the Religious Right attempts to portray secularists as uniformly agnostic or atheistic, adherents to a Secular and Spiritual paradigm explode this ignorant misrepresentation. They intuitively grasp that there is more to human experience than that which can be currently known using only the intellect, or through empirical studies. They pursue their search for spiritual understanding through a wide variety of approaches. These approaches might include:
- The practice of non-western enlightenment exercises like Yoga, Qi Gong, and Tai Chi;
- The study of comparative religion, mythology, and the theories underlying non-western medicine;
- Participation in twelve step groups like Alcoholics Anonymous or Narcotics Anonymous;
- A diet of daily meditation or non-denominational prayer;
- Exploration of the insights of Freudian and transpersonal psychology, NLP, and other methodologies that seek to enhance human understanding, promote personal growth, and extend human potential;
- An effort to grasp contemporary scientific theory, and where possible, reconcile it with the insights of mystics and spiritual teachers of the past.
Some adherents might pursue only one or two of these approaches – like participation in a twelve-step group and non-denominational prayer. Others might incorporate a number of these branches in their lives. Still others might not currently take part in any of these characteristic activities, yet profess an authentic interest in God and spirituality – while currently living largely secular lives. Yet, when asked by a pollster for their religious affiliation, they would be given little choice but to answer “secular” or respond with the name of the religious group they were born into. But as anyone who has browsed online dating sites (like Match.com) can tell you, when given a wider choice of description (as almost all of these sites allow), many people within this demographic choose the label “spiritual but not religious”.
Another area of affinity between the Founders’ and Framers’ approach and the Secular and Spiritual orientation is both groups' embrace of an ethos of progress, and a firm belief in the ultimate improvability of human existence. Enlightenment era thinkers saw study of the laws of nature as capable of producing positive knowledge that would inevitably lead the species onward. In stark contrast to the dark apocalyptic fantasies of the “Left Behind” wing of Christian thought, many leading thinkers within the Secular and Spiritual worldview postulate the possibility of a radical extension of human consciousness, and a faith that human beings are ultimately capable of meeting any challenge that the Cosmos might lay before it.
Yet another significant link between the Founders and Framers and the Secular and Spiritual constituency is both groups’ powerful advocacy of the dual Constitutional imperatives of Freedom of Religion and Separation of Church and State – the very things that the reactionary wings of American Protestantism and Catholicism today seek to erode.
The freedom of conscience and thought that we take for granted in our time is relatively new in human history. For instance, in the eras that preceded the American Revolution (and even in the early years of the Republic, during the period when a few States retained official religions) it was commonplace for independent thinkers to be persecuted for their beliefs. As John Adams related in his 1814 letter to John Taylor:
And, even since the Reformation, when or where has existed a Protestant or dissenting sect who would tolerate a free inquiry? The blackest billingsgate, the most ungentlemanly insolence, the most yahooish brutality is patiently endured, countenanced, propagated, and applauded. But touch a solemn truth in collision with a dogma of a sect, though capable of the clearest proof, and you will soon find you have disturbed a nest, and the hornets will swarm about your legs and hands, and fly into your face and eyes.
Freedom of conscience and thought are essential elements in the Secular and Spiritual worldview. Without either of these conditions, authentic spirituality inevitably yields to dogmatism and religious or intellectual tyranny – and the quest for truth ends. Thus, in the eyes of this diverse and eclectic group, defense of these two bedrock guarantees is seen as a sacred duty, not a burden.
Finally, seen against the backdrop of 9/11, if religious, intellectual, and political tyranny in Muslim countries is considered a problem, then spiritual and intellectual diversity here in America must be a virtue. The Secular and Spiritual movement is an eloquent expression of that virtue. But it is more than just that. In a very real sense, these are the modern day pioneers who within the laboratory of the self are uncovering the heretofore-buried connections between the world’s religious, philosophical, and intellectual traditions. Let me suggest that these are the very same connections that, sooner or later, twenty-first century humanity needs to discover as well.
In the backdrop of 9-11 people found a reason to return to churches, synogogues, and mosques. Religion once again soared as people looked towards those traditions to appease the wounds inside.
But 9-11 represented both the good and bad side of religion. There are very few people who would not remember all those virgins in heaven who the terrorist believe will be waiting to greet them.
Religion, faith, a belief in God is a very personal inner driven experience and a person's life experiences meld into that persons concience to create an individual ideology. The founder of our country understood this--and recognized the slippery slope that faith in God and Government involvement would bring to the rights and well being (common good) of all Americans. Hense, the separation of church and state.
Isn't that ultimately what America is about? The freedom to believe without government interference? While the 'religious-wrong' thinks they hold all the cards on integrity--we know they don't. The time has come to reclaim our faith and our integrity without trying to become carbon copies of them. I'm liberal--and I'm religiously "right" and I will no longer allow myself to feel diminished because I support pregnancy planning and choice as opposed to only being 'anti-choice and anti-gay".
I truly believe God cringes when he sees what is being done in his name.
Bush never mentions Kwan Yin, female Boddhisatva, "Mother of all Buddhas," who will not go to heaven until every living being has gone first.
That is Compassion.
I think that more terror has occurred in the NAME OF religion than anything else.
Democrats Hit Road in Social Security War
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uslatest/story/0,1282,-4910631,00.html
Unbelievable that it ends up like this - it's like election year is still going!
Also watching the buildup to the UK election - it's going to be hot! The public and Labour are split over Blair because he supported the war but they feel they need to back him because conservative Tory candidate is socially regressive in addition. The more progressive Lib Dems don't have enough power. Sound familiar?
Draft may be needed in a year, military analysts warn
http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0330draft30-ON.html
The American society "hasn't gotten the message that we're at war," agreed Carter.
"Those at peril are completely divorced from those in power," said Mark Shields, a syndicated columnist and TV commentator who moderated the symposium. "It's 'Patriotism Lite' -- you put a sticker on your SUV."
"America has a choice," wrote Carter. "It can be the world's superpower or it can maintain the current all-voluntary military. But it probably can't do both."
interesting...
This is so embarrassing in a civlized country.
I don't have the link so hope it's not too long.
We are heading back into the Dark Ages.
18 of the 50 states now have gay marriage bans.
Kansans Debate Before Vote on Same-Sex Marriage
Reuters
KANSAS CITY, Kan. (April 2) - Marriage is the big topic in Kansas this weekend. Yard signs are up, radio ads are running and a "Mayday for Marriage" rally planned. Following the lead of more than a dozen other states, Kansas scheduled a vote Tuesday on whether to amend the state constitution to ban same-sex couples from marrying. One of the toughest in the nation, Kansas' proposed ban also would prevent gays from receiving any of the "rights and incidents" of marriage.
A coalition of Christian clergy from across the state are backing the ban, with help from out-of-state supporters. They have raised more than $125,000 and are blanketing communities with symbols of a veiled bride and tuxedo-wearing groom and repeating whenever they can the mantra "Protect Marriage." A rally Sunday was expected to draw people from around the state to Kansas City.
"We don't want same-sex unions to be considered equal to marriage," said Mike Farmer, Kansas Catholic Conference executive director. "Where does it end? Any two people, any three people, any four people? People who believe in traditional marriage want to do everything they can to protect it." Opponents say the measure does not do anything to protect marriage and is purely discriminatory. "We don't see anything about prohibiting adultery. This message about protecting marriage just rings hollow," said Bruce Ney, chairman of Kansans for Fairness, a coalition opposing the amendment. "This message is about hate."
The opposition is holding its own rally Sunday and has lined up nearly 100 clergy who say the measure violates Christian teachings. Yet they've raised only about $35,000, and they're prepared for a loss. "We'll lose. But it's not right," said the Rev. Robert Meneilly, a retired Presbyterian minister who opposes the amendment. "If we believe that we are made in God's likeness, we all need to be respected and treated the same."
PUBLIC POLICY, BIBLICAL BELIEFS
Kansas would become the 18th state to ban gay marriage through state constitutional amendment. Thirteen states passed similar amendments last year, and conservative Christians have cited the efforts as key in shaping public policy.
Indeed, conservatives have criticized President Bush for not pushing hard enough to pass an amendment to the U.S. Constitution. His quest for the amendment failed last year in Congress. It is not just Kansans active in the Kansas vote. The Knights of Columbus of New Haven, Connecticut, donated $100,000. The Washington-based group Concerned Women for America, which aims to push biblical teachings in public policy, as well as the Coalition of African-American Pastors from Tennessee, are helping lead Sunday's rally.
Movement leaders say they have to pursue constitutional amendments to prevent a liberal judiciary from legalizing homosexual unions.
"If a culture cannot define and protect basic relationships such as marriage then that culture will, I believe, find itself drifting further into chaos and confusion," said Pastor J.K. Warrick of the College Church of the Nazarene in Olathe, Kansas.
As the vote nears, the debate is intensifying as once-private sentiments surface between neighbors, church members, doctors and patients, and parents on playgrounds. "God loves all of us and we are all sinners. We have no right to say this particular sin has to be targeted," said 54-year-old Linda Stoker, a married mother from Johnson County who plans to vote against the amendment. Not so, said Yvonne DiFalco, another Johnson County married mother who planted a pro-amendment sign in her yard. "As a decent society, we want people to know they are loved," said DiFalco. "But we will not waltz them into a life of hell."
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/4/2/20285
Meanwhile, MAY THE REVOLUTION BEGIN-----in Montana ?
Renegade state refuses to go along with the Patriot Act!!!
The West shall rise again!! If the administration isn't with us, it's against us.
I can't get that Kos link to work & before long it'll take forever to open so I'm going to post the Montana legislation below. It's important. Send this around to people - let them know! Contact your representatives & let's get this going in every state!
2005 Montana Legislature SENATE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 19
A JOINT RESOLUTION OF THE SENATE AND THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES OF THE STATE OF MONTANA SUPPORTING THE MONTANA CONSTITUTION, THE UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION, AND THE BILL OF RIGHTS; ENCOURAGING VARIOUS ACTIONS IN SUPPORT OF FIGHTING TERRORISM AND PROTECTING CIVIL RIGHTS AND CIVIL LIBERTIES; REQUESTING THE ATTORNEY GENERAL OF MONTANA TO COMPILE AND DISSEMINATE RELEVANT INFORMATION REGARDING ACTIONS TAKEN BY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT UNDER THE USA PATRIOT ACT; AND ENCOURAGING MONTANA'S CONGRESSIONAL DELEGATION TO SUPPORT AND ENSURE THE CIVIL RIGHTS OF ALL MONTANANS AND CITIZENS OF THE UNITED STATES, WHICH INCLUDES ALLOWING THE USA PATRIOT ACT TO EXPIRE.
WHEREAS, the citizens of Montana recognize the Constitution of the United States as our charter of liberty and that the Bill of Rights enshrines the fundamental and inalienable rights of Americans, including the freedoms of religion, speech, assembly, and privacy; and
WHEREAS, each of Montana's duly elected public servants has sworn to defend and uphold the United States Constitution and the Constitution of the State of Montana; and
WHEREAS, the citizens of Montana denounce and condemn all acts of terrorism by any entity, wherever the acts occur; and
WHEREAS, terrorist attacks against Americans, such as those that occurred on September 11, 2001, have necessitated the crafting of effective laws to protect citizens of the United States and others from terrorist attacks; and
WHEREAS, any new security measures of federal, state, and local governments should be carefully designed and employed to enhance public safety without infringing on the civil liberties and rights of innocent citizens of Montana and the United States; and
WHEREAS, certain provisions of the "Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism Act of 2001", also known as the USA PATRIOT Act, allow the federal government to more liberally detain and investigate citizens and to engage in surveillance activities that may violate or offend the rights and liberties guaranteed by our state and federal constitutions.
NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED BY THE SENATE AND THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES OF THE STATE OF MONTANA:
That the 59th Montana Legislature supports the government of the United States in its campaign against terrorism and affirms the commitment of the United States that the campaign not be waged at the expense of essential civil rights and liberties of citizens of this country that are protected in the United States Constitution and the Bill of Rights.
BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED, that it is the policy of the citizens of Montana to oppose any portion of the USA PATRIOT Act that violates the rights and liberties guaranteed under the Montana Constitution or the United States Constitution, including the Bill of Rights.
BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED, that in accordance with Montana state policy, in the absence of reasonable suspicion of criminal activity under Montana law, the 59th Montana Legislature exhorts agents and instrumentalities of this state to not:
(1) initiate or participate in or assist or cooperate with an inquiry, investigation, surveillance, or detention under the USA PATRIOT Act if the action violates constitutionally guaranteed civil rights or civil liberties;
(2) record, file, or share intelligence information concerning a person or organization, including library lending and research records, book and video store sales and rental records, medical records, financial records, student records, and other personal data, even if authorized under the USA PATRIOT Act, if the action violates constitutionally guaranteed civil rights or civil liberties; or
(3) retain any of the intelligence information described in subsections (1) and (2) of this clause if the information violates constitutionally guaranteed civil rights or civil liberties.
I left word for Max Baucus & Conrad Burns that this is great work & I'm starting in on emailing all the legislators. Not sure this is up to date but it's what I'm using for now.
http://www.lawlibrary.state.mt.us/dscgi/ds.py/View/Collection-1861
Iraq Testimony before the House Armed Services Committee
April 6, 2005 - 10:00am
Location: Washington, DC
On Wednesday, April 6th at 10:00am ET, General Wesley Clark will be testifying before the House Armed Services Committee about Iraq's past, present, and future.
The hearing will be held in 2118 Rayburn House Office Building.
_________________________________________________
Thanks very much for those posts, DIanne. I'm personally convinced that the most hopeful results in the 2006 elections will happen in the Rocky Mountain states. I sure do hope that the Dems can mount some good Senate and House candidates there. ..Yeah. May the West rise again!
Former Senate Majority Leader George Mitchell: Plan to Ban Filbusters, "Unprecedented, Unfair and Unwise"
3 April 2005
Yesterday in the Democratic weekly radio address, Former Senate Majority Leader George Mitchell called the Republican plan to ban filibusters of judicial nominees, "unprecedented, unfair and unwise."
"Neither I nor any other senator, Republican or Democrat, ever dreamed of taking the kind of drastic action now being proposed," said Mitchell, a former federal judge himself who was majority leader from 1988-95 as a senator from Maine.
"We had the power to do so, but we refrained from exercising that power because it was as wrong then as it is now. The end does not justify the means."
MORE - http://www.lightupthedarkness.org/blog/default.asp?view=plink&id=662
Pamela,
Finally, after the DCP filiblog other organizations are talking about the filibuster too.
I personally hope there are some Republicans out there who care about Democracy and not just the sweetness of having 5 more reps this congress.
This is not a democrat issue or even a republican issue; it is a democracy issue. Let's stand strong for our constitution.
Pamela,
How nice of you to weigh in with another thoughtful, personalized, on-topic post here in our latest thread on the DCP website!
Umm... I'm sorry, but *what* was the name of your blog again?
cheers (and roebuck),
Otter
Matt:
One has to laugh when the Christian Right believes it has moral high ground, and then when arguing for "Sanctity of life" in the case of Terri Schiavo, I hear one protester outside of the hospital, on vigil as Terri was clinging to life say: "There is time to KEEP her on life support--and wait for life saving medical advances to find a cure for her brain's degeneration".
Like stem cell research?
Or what about the Catholic Church being against ANY form of birth control, which means no condoms, and the spread of AIDS, which is killing societies and generations. Statistics in Africa, Asia, Eastern Europe and the US showing an increase, especially among women, of the rise of HIV infections.
Selective ethics and piecemeal morality, which I think affects both left and right sides of the debate, is so much like the rhetoric and Red-baiting of the fifties and sixties during the Cold War. The way BOTH liberals and conservatives categorize/demonize each other has a similar ring, and similar irrelevancy, as race and ethnicity categories in government forms, or communists versus capitalists in present day and age.
I think in order to re-synthesize our country's currently fractured cultural soul, there has to be a further breakdown of religious categorizations in society, and a willingness to open to the rise of a non-descript yet potent force of spiritual community that knows no boundaries, races, ethnicities, cultures, gender or regional politics. Perhaps because we are seeing this continued need to redefine and LEGISLATE what is sacred, that the precepts of morality are slipping away, and people are trying to grasp for moral certainty in a rapidly changing and uncertain world.
What we are experiencing now IS the breakdown. I only wish that those who have the most fear of this change and breakdown were not so much in control.
The early 21st century has placed major religions at political odds. Will there be a way that the fundamentalists of Christianity, Islam, and Judaism finally back down? Does one group have to bring all of us to the brink before this happens?
You go to school for secular education, and you go to your church, temple, mosque, etc for your religious education and worship. if you wish you can send your child to a private school that teaches both. But, the government cannot send your child to a mosque, or to a temple, or to a church.
We do not tolerate this for our children, but the same group wishes to promote this for our government? At what point do our representatives stand up to the onslaught of our Constitution?
The Declaration of Independance and the Constitution of the United States are documents that guarantee our government will follow the rule of LAW, not the fervor of belief.
The same Bible used to promote these ideals, refutes the arguement made by religious traditionalists. The most well known being "render unto ceasar what is ceasar's, render unto god what is god"
This is a clear seperation of government and religious mechanism. God laid out these rules for very good reason; Religious power corrupts more than Political power. History is replete with horrific examples of religious traditionalists exerting newfound power. Witch burnings, tortures, genocides, it is a long list.
The common denominator is religious power. The fact these groups ignore their own biblical teachings bear witness to the blindness that religious power exerts.
The Democratic party is absent from this battle, It is time to stand and perform the duties of Elected office. The Constitution gives.. no... the Constitution Obligates every Member of Congress and Senate to draw this line and say NO MORE.
The Nation will stand behind one honest voice, against this rush of Religious zealotry.
One Voice of Conviction, that believes in the Constitution, the document this Nation calls the foundation of Freedom and Liberty.
The Time is Now.
Posted by: Sparrow at April 3, 2005 04:31 PM
Yes, it's great when other's jump in and support a cause when asked. We were happy to post DCP's Filiblog as soon as we got word on it (http://www.lightupthedarkness.org/blog/default.asp?view=plink&id=642).
LUTD is very supportive of various issues and causes around the blogosphere and rarely hestitate to post a thread about an issue that other's are rallying around.
It's a shame not everyone in the blogosphere can see their way clear to do that. I know our requests for supporting issues we are championing have been ignored by some in the past.
But we're always happy to do what we can... it's all about getting the word out, creating a strong network and standing up for the issues important to all of us.
If you haven't seen it we have a downloadable Petition and Talking Points for those who want to take to the streets and get the word out on this issue.
Posted by: Otter at April 3, 2005 05:08 PM
And your point is?
Sandy & I have been very, very supportive of DCP from the onset Otter of both LUTD and DCP. As soon as LUTD went online we had links to DCP.
Granted, we don't always have time to join in the conversation here, what with both of us running businesses and LUTD, but we do try.
Certainly if you or anyone from DCP posts links to threads here in the comments of LUTD threads, on topic or not, we don't make issue of it!
If there is an issue with myself, Sandy or Ron posting quips from our blog here to let you all know what we are up to, perhaps Dick or Karen should let us know.
We were under the impression that we were mutually supporting each other. It's kind of sad to stop back here and read your response.
Excellent post Matthew,
I have read What's the Matter With Kansas? by Thomas Frank. I think his commentary speaks very well to the issue raised in the post for this thread. The logical argument you submit is one that requires thoughtful consideration. Yet the neo-cons are of such an anti-intellectual persuasion, that logical discourse is beyond them. It is incumbent upon us to clearly make the case demonstrating the total hypocrisy of the ultra-right wing. If we can do that without creating fear among the more moderate Republicans that our position is not anti-religion, we will succeed. We have seen that the majority of Americans were totally against the right wing conspiracy and manipulation of the federal government when the government tried to intrude into the private life of a family in distress. Along with that I believe most Americans realize the slippery slope we stepped onto. Americans want to be comfortable that those in opposition to what happened are not anti-religious. Once they can be assured of that fact, then our mission will be that much easier.
Attempting to engage people who have no interest in logical discourse is a waste of time. Our efforts are better focused on those who are willing to listen and consider different points of view.
Pamela,
Let me make it very clear here that I am speaking as a "me", not a "we". I really like your LUTD website, I read it often and I recommend it frequently to others as well. I think what you've built there is a very good example of both form and content when it comes to to political blogospherication.
My point, though, is that from this end of things it sometimes appears as though you & Ron & Co. come here and do pre-canned hit-and-run posts advertising your latest LUTD blog contents, whether they're in context of the thread or not... and when that happens, it leads me to think that the same posts are probably appearing verbatim on a number of other progressive-oriented blogs at the same time.
When that happens, it feels to me as though you drop in, post here, and then disappear again, and that seems more like part of a blog-promotion campaign than a personal comment these days.
If I'm incorrect in this, then I certainly do apologize. It's just that I miss the presence of you and Ron as part of the ongoing conversations here on our blog and forums.
You're both very engaging, thoughtful, well-informed writers, and I'd rather be involved in two-way discussions with you than a sequence of one-way posts, is all.
hoping this helps explain my point,
Otter
Otter,
We're all pretty busy these days and spread rather thin. Especially myself. I guess we could say the same thing as well... we'd love to see more conversations with our friends on LUTD. But we understand everyone is busy and there's only so much time in the day and so many blogs one can participate on and still get work done.
As for a blog promotion campaign, I think that we would all like to see both DCP and LUTD be successful in the blogosphere. So we happily try to promote DCP (and other blogs of interest) as frequently as possible on LUTD.
http://cnn.netscape.cnn.com/news/story.jsp?floc=ne-main-9-l1&flok=FF-APO-1110&idq=/ff/story/0001%2F20050403%2F1804762338.htm&sc=1110
Schiavo Case Spurring Statehouse Debate
Posted by: DiAnne at April 3, 2005 11:20 AM
DiAnne
The thought of Bush mentioning Quan Yin cracks me up. Do you think he even is familar with Quan Yin? Born Again's have a big issue with the Goddess in any of her incarnations.
I just hand wrote the article about the pope by Hans Kung and it's posted on the previous thread...for those interested participants.
It's interesting that as I wrote that article how many comparisons the pope and Bush have in common !!
Pamela
Kwan Yin would completely blow his circuits.
I was just looking at the program from the Women of Wisdom Conference that was just here & it's completely alien from his world, with good reason. The only thing we can hope for is an eventual pendulum swing in the complete opposite direction things are going. Sending his wife to Afghanistan to champion women is laughable.
Because I have been so busy this weekend I have missed Pope Watch - or as Linda correctly calls it - the beginning of ShrubCo's Papal Distraction Week. Of course in between errands it hard not to get momentarily sucked in. However, I pretty much had my fill when an analyst from Newsweek called The Pope, Mandela, and Reagan the last of the great 20th century giants, with Mandela the last one remaining. No disresepect to the dead and all but, Reagan in the league of those two? Come on give me a break. What's in that kool-aid anyway?
Okay, had to add this since it kinda relates to the thread topic. NBC is running promos for its "end of days" tv movie - Revelation. Apparently NBC's ratings have sunken like a rock and they go for the easy ratings kill by catering to ShrubCo's doomsday flock.
NBC is no-longer must-see tv. Now it's doomday tv.
NBC - Adding more fuel to America's endtime/millenium fervor.
Mandela Reagan & the Pope?
NBC showing a Revelations series?
LOL - I guess I came to the right place for entertainment & I'm wore my "Chirac Help Us"
t-shirt to the mall food court. No one tried
to convert me tonight.
Here's part of why there is distraction going on:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-4911658,00.html
Poll Finds DeLay's Support Has Slipped
HOUSTON (AP) - Support for House Majority Leader Tom DeLay has slipped in his district, and a majority of voters surveyed disapprove of his decision to lead Congress into the Terri Schiavo case, according to a Houston Chronicle poll. Forty-five percent of 501 voters questioned last week said they would vote for someone else if a congressional election were at hand, while about 38 percent said they would re-elect DeLay.
The powerful Texas Republican maintained that his constituents backed his decision to take Congress into the dispute over whether to keep the severely brain-damaged woman alive. But nearly 58 percent of those surveyed said they opposed his decision, while about 33 percent expressed support. `There seems to be no question that there has been an erosion in support for the congressman,'' said John Zogby, whose company Zogby International conducted the poll. ``These are not good re-election numbers.'' DeLay spokesman Dan Allen defended the congressman's record. Voters have been electing DeLay for more than 20 years ``because he's getting things done for the area. He's also earned their support because they know he's guided by principles not polls,'' Allen said Sunday.
DeLay, who has been admonished three times by the House Ethics Committee, won his 11th term in 2004 with 55 percent of the vote, his lowest share ever. The poll findings come about a year-and-a-half before he faces re-election. About 40 percent of those polled said their opinion of DeLay has grown less favorable in the last year. Eleven percent said their view of him has improved, and about 47 percent said their opinion has not changed.
Questions have also been raised about financial backing for some of DeLay's overseas trips, and a county prosecutor is investigating fund-raising tactics of a political action committee DeLay helped establish. The poll of 501 voters in Texas' 22nd Congressional District was conducted Wednesday through Friday and had a margin of error of plus or minus 4.5 percentage points.
Posted by: DiAnne at April 3, 2005 09:08 PM
DiAnne
Did you go to the Women of Wisdom comference? I've wanted to go for a few years now.
DiAnne,
Back away from the mall food court! That stuff will kill you!
Posted by: Patti Ferschke at April 3, 2005 08:57 PM
Pope John Paul was considered to be a conservative. No doubt he had things in common with Bush. I do hope they choose a new Pope who is little more moderate... let alone is it too much to hope that they choose one more liberal!
Pamela
I went to some of it - the founder Kris Steinnes is my good friend & also Reverend Rosa Redtail.
Next year ok?!
Karen
I can't resist the Chinese fast food or the pastries at the bakery my son works at. I'll never lose the weight I gained since 11/3 but maybe it's ok. Not very into self-denial!
Patti
You mean you broke both arms & when you are barely recovered, you HAND TYPED a long passage onto the blog!!! Why am I not surprised?!!
Posted by: DiAnne at April 3, 2005 11:07 PM
DiAnne
I used to be on their email list. Sounds like a plan... next year! I'm working hard on getting caught up on my life, my business and getting things back on track so that I can have a life again. LOL! Keep me posted on that okay.
Since Pope John II chose most of the Cardinals, they are likely going to elect a clone...
As a start, let women be Priests and move into the higher church hierarchy.
Allow priests to marry. In the 12 and 13 century, there were married priests.
Today, if a guy is married already, he can become a priest..just can't marry after becoming a priest...
what nonsense...
Hi Pam...how's the wings?
You are really amazing to do this with busted arms..
Benson and the WMD charge being "dead wrong"
http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/opinions/benson/
Battlebob
It was Patti with the busted wings, but Pamela is a Goddess too.
Plug time:
This is the Women of Wisdom website:
http://www.womenofwisdom.org
This is the Electronic Democracy Forum, website
of my brother's friend in Colorado.
http://odasz.oldcolo.com
Another view of Terri from someone who is going thru it now.
http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/viewpoints/articles/0403jennings0403.html
Errggg..uuuhhh..sheepish...
Get well all..
Battlebob-
I wouldn't want to live like that & I have papers to prove it. I also don't see Bush et al speaking out for the mentally ill, who may be physically intact but for some (like my sister), life is terrifying. I also think that distrust of doctors (as expressed in this article) is partly a coping mechanism for a sad situation.
People ought to think more about heroic means and the implications in the first place.
DiAnne,
I agree with you. This just shows another side of the coin.
At a seminar for fourth generation warfare, Thomas P.M. Barnett said countries will only enter real economic prosperity when women can participate fully in society. This made me think of organizations such as the Catholic Church that refuse to allow women a seat at the adult table. The Church will remain the way it is until the power structure changes. That won't change until membership drops.
So all you Catholic women out there...don't go!!!
BB,
That is not so much a view as it is a sermon. I truly feel sorry for the author and her family. Yet her analysis implies Terri Schiavo's wishes were honored only in the name of "convenience". I can't pretend to know the hardships the author is facing on a day to day basis. Obviously, the author's opinion is valid and she has reached a very different decision than the Schiavo's did. Despite the emotional suggestions of a life that is somehow cognizant of its surroundings she, like all of us, is in no position to critique the Schiavo's decisions.
battlebob:
I knew back when I was 14 that I shouldn't go back to church, and I haven't regretted that.
That hasn't stopped me from becoming a spiritual person. I think most of us here have deeply felt spiritual values not expressed in the language of religions.
I hope we one day form our own language of inclusion and tolerance and compassion. Right now, we're bridging and straddling more than a few worlds, and plenty of people are dropping through the cracks because of the differences, made worse by intolerance. And that goes for both sides of the argument.
Posted by: Fe at April 4, 2005 12:50 AM
Well said Fe...
Personally I feel that the whole world is a church and I don't need to go to one to be in touch with God(dess) or my higher power.
Just testing
Oh, so dwahzon is being a little testy this morning, hmm hmm?
I couldn't believe that this mouthy bunch hadn't put up a post since 1:34 am last night and since I had been making some website changes, I thought I'd better check to see that I hadn't broken anything. ;)
dw
There are plenty of American churchgoers who do not bother to care or learn about the planet & the people on it & how they live. They the continue their rapacious lifestyle - giant SUVs, driving around for no reason, heating humongous suburban houses with a bathroom for each person including children plus guests & doing all of this on credit. They don't even realize that they are fairly directly responsible for poverty and death of others (including many children) by their lifestyle & by their listening to & condoning the actions of this oil-lusting administration. The information is out there and not hard to find. Aren't they curious about Darfur, East Timor, Rwanda, Afghanistan (I mean BEFORE 9/11 - they were having a famine!) - no. They say they're busy - we're all busy. That such families attend church frequently only damns their Bush-supporting churches, in my mind. The church teaches them that the whole world needs to find one religion - the one they sell. "Why do they hate us?" they ask. Wake up!
I will say that I am proud to have eaten & drank on St. Patrick's Day with a group of Catholic priests and nuns. They were much more world-conscious and were antiwar but they are one faction. One of them said, "The administration talks about spreading freedom and democracy but why is it that it always ends up to be war?" I see more consistency and less proselytization even though I don't agree with some of the positions and don't believe the theology.
I will go on record as saying that I consider the "Left Behind" type of "Christians" insane, dangerous, heretical cultists and it just blows me away to think that we have a countless number of them in this country, including in power.
We have a very sound strategy in Texas and real possibility of defeating Tom Delay in '06.
Will keep you posted about candidates when authorized, but they will be serious.
Also: "In a letter being delivered today to Sen. Richard G. Lugar (R-Ind.), chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, other committee members and congressional leaders, they said the attack on Bolton is really an attack on President Bush's policies.
Urging bloggers to once again contact Senator Chafee's office before Saturday and urge your opposition to Boulton.
"A hearing on the nomination is set for Thursday.
Last week, 62 critics of Bolton signed a letter calling for his rejection by the Senate, especially because of his opposition to several U.S. arms control treaties"
Viewing some of the coverage in Rome this am,I had this thought. Not ONE lone woman in that procession does NOT represent the "body of Christ" and the brotherhood of mankind,as per the teachings of Christ. What hypocisy! The sins of the "Father" will only be passed on to the next generation. Our own American Cardinals and Bishops only wear sheep's clothing. What the world needs now is less oppression,less force and we, as the "body of Christ" move forward,we must reject what negativity this cardinal electoral college will and must come to grips with. Let's pray for hope, that the new windows of Vatican II are renewed for a new day and a different time.
As Joan Chittister said in her recent letter: "We look "fairly alert" but we are all struggling to breathe,to speak,to go on living in a world in which parts of it,and parts of ourselves are clearly long gone. The problem is that no one is really sure which parts they are."
http://www.nationalcatholicreporter.org/fwis/
Call to Renewal is a national network of churches, faith-based organizations, and individuals working to overcome poverty in America. This organization and Sojourners are both headed by Jim Wallis.
This post deals with Call to Renewal’s "Living Family Income" Campaign
[snip]
The Call to Renewal Living Family Income Campaign will raise awareness for the many challenges to economic security for low-income families -- and prompt public policy that provides increased opportunities and reduced poverty. It will expand the discussion of “moral values” to include the moral and biblical imperative to care for “the least of these.”
The Dem message should embrace this issue and campaign goals. There are obviously other issues that aren't mentioned here such as abortion and gay/Lesbian rights.
http://www.calltorenewal.org/public_policy/index.cfm/action/policy/item/lfi_2005.HTML
Hey, hey, one of Bush's best buddies got what he deserves! Berlusconi lost 6 of the 8 regions he controlled at the last Regional Elections in Italy!
If that might happen to you in 2006, what a slap for Bush and Co!
Hooray!
BB,I'm reading Wallis's book,"God's Politics" and in it Wallis describes this conversation with a conservative in regard to an appropriate dem or alternative candidate.
I will quote from the book:
"What would you do if you faced a candidate who took a traditional moral stance on social and cultural issues? They would not be mean-spirited and,for example,blame gay people for the breakdown of family,nor would they criminalize the choices of desperate women backed into a difficult and dangerous corners. But the candidate decidedly be pro-family,pro-life(meaning really want to lower the abortion rate),strong on personal responsibilty and moral values,outspoken against the moral pollution throughout pop culture,that makes raising children in America a countercultural activity. And what if the candidate was also an economic populist,pro-poor in social policy,tough on corporate corruption and power,clear in supporting middle-and working class families in health care and education,an environmentalist,committed to to a foreign policy thta emphasized international law over per-emptive and unilateral war? What would you do?,I asked. He paused for a long time and then said,"We would panic!"
It's my belief we had that candidate in JK (minus a few of those perks)and the republicans were threatened,did just that.....they panicked,ran a negative "values" campaign,and we never got our message out,as the press often reported,"where's the message?" More importantly,the media is truly at fault for misguiding the public on policy,open debate and treated this past election like a horse race! How someone can lose three debates and still win the presidency w/o thruth telling and doing...NOT in my book of values!
This book should be on e1's reading list,as in it are our talking points for the next go-around!
Patti--et al,,
Wallis' book is next in the Book Club! Look for Tela Zasloff to lead the discussion here, in the forum and the irc. Hopefully, Matt Carnicelli and battlebob and oncall will join in to keep it all going along...we have a lot to learn quickly!
"I hope we one day form our own language of inclusion and tolerance and compassion. Right now, we're bridging and straddling more than a few worlds, and plenty of people are dropping through the cracks because of the differences, made worse by intolerance. And that goes for both sides of the argument."
~~Posted by: Fe at April 4, 2005 12:50 AM
Some of us are spending time doing just that; working on the language, at the same time we're bridging worlds. :-)
"When you take a leap of faith, you must believe, there will be something solid for you to stand on, or, you will be taught how to fly."
~~Sr. Maurice Doody
As Pamela said above, there are only so many hours in the day. The politics of division isn't anything I'm going to contribute to. If I wanted to do that, as I said many times during the campaign, I'd go join BushInc's team.
I think BushInc has done a masterful job transforming the natural grief of 9/11 into not only fear, but a culture of victimhood. Getting a body of people to move beyond a culture they're being spoonfed daily as nourishment is going to take words, work, tolerance and prayer, at the very least. As in, "you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink."
Great post, Matt.