Live Blogging the *Indictments*

Ray McGovern up first. He describes the current situation as "beyond the pale."

He is reading from a friend who served in Iraq--specifically at Abu Ghraib. He declined to interrogate anyone. But he says, "everyone is paying the price."

Ray McGovern pointing out that institutional voices cannot find those voices. The church is an example.

He is citing a story of a German professor who was killed by the Nazis. The professor had a note in his pocket that said "guilt." But it went on to say that he was guilty of not speaking up sooner.

Former Brigadier Janet Karpinski and Scott Ritter will be speaking at the tribunal on January 22. Also today they are delivering a note from world citizens to Kofi Annan, asking for an investigation into torture.

They are heading for the White House to deliver the indictments. I'll take pics now.

Watching your messages Karen!! will there be a transcript of statements made by Mc Govern etc?

The question is out there--is an event such as today"s delivery of indictments from a self-defined *tribunal* (www.bushcommission.org) worth covering? Worth even knowing about? Worth doing at all?

This is a roundabout answer to the question.

In 1994 i visited the White house, the senate, the house of representatives. I met with congressman, senators, executive branch officials, and continued visiting the Nations Capital through the end of President Clintons term(s).
Those visit(s) changed my life, and still impact the manner i view government and prioroties, both Business and Socially.

All things are worth knowing about, covering and doing. The visit to DC was to see what Republicans were trying to accomplish with the contract with America. I went a Conservative and came back a Liberal, thanks to interaction with our representatives and speaking one on one with elected officials.

Our government must remain an Open book, our press must remain focused on that goal and our citizens must learn to demand answers.

It all starts with seeing things for yourself.

Looking forward to the pictures, Karen.

For all those who can and consider it worthy, please recommend this diary at kos:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/1/10/14848/2674

Thanks

"It all starts with seeing things for yourself."

Toolmaker knows.

get up stand up stand up for your rights,
Otter

dwahzon:

Can, do, and done.

:0)

get up stand up don't give up the fight,
Otter

Alito is making it clear that he will rule in favor of Tom DeLay's Texas reDistricting plan.

His ruling prohibited an employee from suing under the Family and Medical Leave Act.

Toolmaker
I did know about that progression, based on firsthand experience. Thanks!!

Karen
I wish I could see Ritter & Karpinski, as I have been following them since I knew about them.

"Fantasy imagines success; striving asks: 'What do I do next?' "

-- William Raspberry

quoted without comment,
Otter

Somebody better warn Ritter and Karpinski that they're being stalked by somebody who is not their president...

:0)

arbusto delenda est,
Otter

"I would approach Roe v Wade with an open mind he told Arlen Specter." Wrong Mr. Alito its settled law. His code: put me on the court and trust me.

Yeah, *right*.

Karen updated thread header again

Calif. Rep. Rohrabacher defends Abramoff
By ERICA WERNER, Associated Press Writer
Last Updated 7:39 am PST Tuesday, January 10, 2006
WASHINGTON (AP) - Rep. Dana Rohrabacher, R-Calif., came to the defense of disgraced former lobbyist Jack Abramoff on Monday, saying he's a good person who's been unjustly criticized.

"I think that he obviously has done some things that are wrong and illegal and he's going to have to pay the price for it,", dah, Rohrabacher said. "I think that a lot of other things that have been characterized as corruption on the part of Abramoff are actually standard operating procedures for lobbying in Washington, D.C. - arranging trips and things like that.

"So I think that he's received a lot of unjust criticism."

Republicans are now defending Abramoff. I never thought that even folks like Rohrbacher would be that stupid. Another great billboard idea. Republicans saying Abramoff received a lot of unjust criticism.

Sounds to me like Rep. Dana Rohrabacher (R, CA) is about to receive a *whole* lot of very just criticism... if the likes of us have anything to say about it, that is.

and we certainly do,
Otter

personally Otter I would like to hear Dana repeat that statement over and over again. Perhaps a call to his office with a thank you, givem hell message, and lets hear more about Abramoff, Dana.

It really reinforces their image as the party of corruption.

He's no rocket scientist, and apparently studied the same english as Dubya...

"Despite a number of problems, I believe NASA's space science program remains its greatest success." - Rep. Dana Rohrbacher, 2000 (R-CA)

"Despite my being a patently clueless idiot, I believe that my public stupidity program remains my greatest success."

who *elected* these sh*tferbrains anyway?,
Otter

Speaking of sh**-fer-brains, the reason there are no pics with this story yet is that I seem to have--ahhh--misplaced the interface cable.

{pulling hair out now}

I plan to go to the event on Sunday, the 22nd with Ritter and Karpinski. Yet to determine whether Riverside Church or Columbia U. Without laptop, and this be chaos, does Matt and his computer still want to join me?

Oops, checked, it's at Columbia.

Don't ask me where I get this stuff. My poor widdle otter haid is a veritable fountain of totally useless random-access information.

"Fox News Channel anchor Shepard Smith was arrested by Florida police in November 2000 and charged with aggravated battery with a motor vehicle after arguing with another reporter over a parking space (both were covering the Bush-Gore Florida vote debacle)."

say wha?,
Otter

Oh yeah, that Shep is a real badass.

Foxy lady.

US Senator Kerry to visit Middle East, South Asia
Tue Jan 10, 1:45 PM ET

WASHINGTON (AFP) - US Senator John Kerry will travel next week to Iraq and Afghanistan as part of a 12-day trip to assess progress on the US war on terror, his office announced.

The former Democratic presidential candidate will commence his trip Tuesday in London, the first stop of a tour of several countries in Asia and the Middle East, according to a statement.

Kerry is traveling to the Middle East "to focus on the steps that must be taken in Iraq and hear from experts in the region about the war in Iraq, the war on terror and the Middle East peace process," his office said.

Kerry's itinerary also includes Pakistan, Jordan, Kuwait, Israel and India. In addition to military and security issues, he will focus on global health crises and US competitiveness in the global economy.

On Tuesday, he planned to meet with British intelligence officials and with Britain's Chancellor of the Exchequer Gordon Brown.

In India on Wednesday, he tentatively planned to meet with with Prime Minister Manmohan Singh, Congress Party President Sonia Gandhi, and National Security Advisor MK Narayanan.

Turning more to US military matters, the US lawmaker will travel to Afghanistan on January 16 and Iraq on January 18, where he is to meet with US troops, military commanders and diplomatic officials, according to the statement

http://hometown.aol.com/chells4681/teresaandjohn.html

Reason #666 for why I think this country is screwed...

Poll finds U.S. split over eavesdropping
Half say warrants unnecessary; most want changes to Patriot Act

Tuesday, January 10, 2006

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Though Americans are growing more skeptical of the White House record on civil liberties, the nation is divided over whether the Bush administration should use wiretaps without first obtaining a warrant, a recent poll shows.

A CNN/USA Today/Gallup poll of 1,003 adults found that 50 percent of those polled believe it's OK to forego warrants when ordering electronic surveillance of people suspected of having ties to terrorists abroad.

Another 46 percent said the policy is wrong, and 4 percent said they had no opinion.

The poll, conducted Friday through Sunday, has a sampling error of 3 percentage points.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/01/10/poll.wiretaps/index.html

Think we're being spied on? Check out Rawstory:

National Security Agency mounted massive spy op on Baltimore peace group, documents show

snip

According to the documents, the Pledge of Resistance-Baltimore, a Quaker-linked peace group, has been monitored by the NSA working with the Baltimore Intelligence Unit of the Baltimore City Police Department.

snip

Documents turned over by the NSA indicate that the group was closely monitored. In one instance, the agency filed reports approximately every 15 minutes from 9:30 AM to 3:18 PM on the day of a demonstration at the National Vigilance Airplane Memorial on the NSA Campus in Maryland.

According to an NSA email dated July 4, 2004, the agency collected license numbers and descriptions and the number of people in each car and filed a report about them gathering in a church parking lot for the demonstration. NSA agents also logged their travel to the demonstration, including stopping as a gas station along the way. A canine dog unit was used to search a minivan when it was stopped on the way to the demonstration - nothing was found.

more, including link to NSA documents here:
http://rawstory.com/news/2005/National_Security_Agency_spied_on_Baltimore_0110.html

Has anyone gotten a response from their request for their FOIA report?

What does the NSA have against the Quakers??? I remember this from right after the eavesdropping thing broke...

WASHINGTON - A year ago, at a Quaker Meeting House in Lake Worth, Fla., a small group of activists met to plan a protest of military recruiting at local high schools. What they didn't know was that their meeting had come to the attention of the U.S. military.

A secret 400-page Defense Department document obtained by NBC News lists the Lake Worth meeting as a “threat” and one of more than 1,500 “suspicious incidents” across the country over a recent 10-month period.

“This peaceful, educationally oriented group being a threat is incredible,” says Evy Grachow, a member of the Florida group called The Truth Project.

“This is incredible,” adds group member Rich Hersh. “It's an example of paranoia by our government,” he says. “We're not doing anything illegal.”

The Defense Department document is the first inside look at how the U.S. military has stepped up intelligence collection inside this country since 9/11, which now includes the monitoring of peaceful anti-war and counter-military recruitment groups.

“I think Americans should be concerned that the military, in fact, has reached too far,” says NBC News military analyst Bill Arkin.

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/10454316/

Clinton, troops have chance encounter
Former president, returneees from Iraq meet at Maine airport

Tuesday, January 10, 2006

BANGOR, Maine (AP) -- Former President Bill Clinton surprised U.S. troops from Iraq when his refueling stop at the Bangor International Airport coincided with their arrival.

His plans for a quick departure Monday night were delayed when a problem was discovered with the aircraft, allowing him to join a line of local greeters who meet each plane carrying troops returning from overseas or leaving for duty.

"Thank you for your service," Clinton said as he shook hands and hugged many of the troops. He autographed hats, cards and other items. (Watch Clinton's encounter with the soldiers -- :43)

Clinton had some fun when Army Spc. Joshua Ruschenberg used a cell phone provided by troop greeters to call to his sister-in-law, Shancy Garrison, in North Carolina. He handed over the phone to the former commander in chief.

"Hi, Shancy, it's Bill Clinton," the former president said into the phone.

The troops, about 600 of them, were returning to bases in Oklahoma, Texas and Georgia. Their two chartered aircraft had landed for fuel.

"This is great," Staff Sgt. Anthony Thompson of New York City told the Bangor Daily News.

more... http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/01/10/clinton.troops.ap/index.html

Modern Love
by David Bowie

I don’t want to go out
I won't stay in
Get things done

I catch a paper boy
But things don’t really change
I’m standing in the wind
But I never wave bye-bye

But I try, I try

There’s no sign of life
It’s just the power to charm
I’m lying in the rain
But I never wave bye-bye

But I try, I try

Never gonna fall for
Modern love - walks beside me
Modern love - walks on by
Modern love - gets me to the church on time
Church on time - terrifies me
Church on time - makes me party
Church on time - puts my trust in God and man
God and man - no confessions
God and man - no religion
God and man - don’t believe in modern love

It’s not really work
It’s just the power to charm
I’m still standing in the wind
But I never wave bye bye

But I try, I try

Never gonna fall for
Modern love - walks beside me
Modern love - walks on by
Modern love - gets me to the church on time
Church on time - terrifies me
Church on time - makes me party
Church on time - puts my trust in God and man
God and man - no confessions
God and man - no religion
God and man - don’t believe in modern love
Modern love - walks beside me
Modern love - walks on by
Modern love - gets me to the church on time
Church on time - terrifies me
Church on time - makes me party
Church on time - puts my trust in God and man
God and man - no confessions
God and man - no religion
God and man - I don’t believe in modern love

Modern love - modern love, walks beside me
Modern love - modern love, walks on by
Modern love - modern love, walks beside me
Modern love - modern love, walks on by
Never gonna fall for
Never gonna fall for

I'm going to this tonight - maybe I can read a really embarrassing old blog entry. I should have many!

Oh, the awful things we write when we think no one is listening …
Seattle's Salon of Shame

The idea is simple: we read embarrassing things in front of you. Inspired by the horrific things we used to furtively scribble in our diaries, Electrolicious and A Guide To Visitors invite you to join us as we excise the demons of truly embarrassing writing. Seattle-area writers stand before and read unsent letters, bad poetry, melodramatic diary entries, and other bits of horrific ephemerata. The only rule? The writer can only read their own shameful words. No embarrassing others; only yourself. Excruciating tales of heartbreak! Agonizing descriptions of early drug experiences! Teen perspectives on world politics! It's all here, served on a verbal platter for you to drink up and enjoy.

The first Salon of Shame happened on November 9 and was a huge success with an over-capacity crowd! The next one promises to be even more embarrassing. Be sure to arrive early to ensure you get a seat.

Whole Foods Switches to Renewable Energy

http://news.independent.co.uk/business/news/article337821.ece

This is cool! Some industries are ahead of the government (which doesn't take much).

that sounds tres cool

Karen,

Thank you for covering the event. Although I was not able to be here earlier today, you don't know how nice it is to come on and see that you reported it live.

Though some may call it a stunt, what would actually happen should Bush come out and actually TALK to the people who he represents. He wouldn't talk to Cindy and he certainly doesn't talk to the media without someone in the room to correct him.

I do find it ironic however that former Pres. Clinton only had to run from a woman in a blue dress; whereas this pResident runs from everyone.

This is too sad to take. Read this!

Selective abortion: 10 million girls 'missing' in India Mon Jan 9, 1:19 AM ET

PARIS (AFP) - Around 10 million female foetuses may have been aborted in India over the past two decades because of ultrasound sex screening and a traditional preference for boys, according to a study published online in The Lancet.

Researchers based in Canada and India looked through data from a national survey, conducted among 1.1 million households in 1998, and at information about 133,738 births that took place in 1997.

http://tinyurl.com/awbux

http://tinyurl.com/dftyp

Looks like the least favorite Democrat of all may face some opposition this year from an anti-war candidate in the primaries. If that fails, he may face some even stiffer oppositon from a well known name running as an indy.
Very interesting.
Maybe we won't have Joe to kick around anymore after November. I certainly hope not anyway.

The tribal wisdom of the Dakota Indians, passed down from generation to generation, says that "When you discover that you are riding a dead horse, the best strategy is to dismount."

The Bush administration, in its infinite wisdom, has chosen to employ more advanced strategies instead:

1. Spending 175 million dollars so Halliburton can build a stronger whip to use on dead horses.

2. Changing riders on all dead horses. Preferably in the middle of the stream.

3. First obstructing, then appointing a committee to study dead horses. Then denying any knowledge of, or support for, the expired-equine committee.

4. Arranging to visit other countries to see how other cultures ride horses. Then ignoring anything they have to say about horses unless it means we can invade Iran next.

5. Lowering the standards so that dead horses can be included in new pork-barrel government benefits programs aimed at expanding the tax-deductible status of expired equines.

6. Reclassifying dead horses as "living impaired", thereby denying the dead horses access to any pre-existing government benefits aimed at easing the plight of expired equines.

7. Hiring outside contractors to ride the dead horses, preferably on no-bid contracts with fine print clauses specifying that only Texas-based firms need apply.

8. Harnessing several dead horses together to increase speed. Then cooking the data and manipulating the results so that Fox News will generate a five-day series of breaking-news reports about the new, improved dead horses.

9. Providing additional funding and/or training to increase the dead horses' performance. But only after cutting the dead horses' owners' taxes first.

10. Doing a productivity study to see if lighter riders would improve dead horses' performance. If the study indicates that the horses would have a higher survivability ratio if they were wearing adequate body armor, then doing another study to prove that body armor gives horses cancer and/or terminal halitosis.

11. Declaring that as dead horses do not have to be fed, they are less costly, carry lower overhead, and therefore contribute substantially more to the bottom line of the economy than live horses do. Then introducing legislation to give the dead horses private retirement accounts.

12. Rewriting the expected performance requirements for all horses, dead or not.

And, if all else fails...

13. Promoting the original dead horse to a newly-created Cabinet-level position.

just say neigh,
Otter

Posted by: Linda Enterkin at January 10, 2006 08:37 PM

Linda,

I read your note to me about the Hillary thing, and I wanted to comment that I'm also glad we were able to agree on the Bankruptcy aspect and that we both agreed that the omnibus bill was different.

Thanks for showing your respect for my thoughts even when you posted some corrections. I really did appreciate it.

neigh!

neigh, mudderfudder!

I saw a dead horse in a tree in Venice, LA.

Not the worst I saw.

Veritas
Hi! Sebastien is now in NYC & will be starting his internship with Clinton - he said to tell you hi!

Fantastic!

Say hi back. He's a great guy. Really laid-back. I had so much fun chatting with him I forgot to practice my French.

Veritas, I wouldn't touch that straight line with un cheval morte.

okay wilburrr-rr-rrr,
Otter

Hi Veritas! Welcome back!

Ne pensez-vous pas que je sois...chevaleresque?

quel dommage...

Chuck in Doha for Ira:

On the billboard theme, here is one I would vote for using some day (thanks to Carol's post on the prior thread):

"Chuck Grassley to Alito:

"Sic 'It's OK if you forget a promise that you made to this committee about recusing yourself from a conflict of interest case. We senators forget our promises all the time.'

"NICE.

"Posted by: Carol at January 10, 2006 11:57 AM"

So, picture Chuck Grassley's big smiling face, and right next to it a quote: "We senators forget our promises all the time."

Chuck in Doha

Darn it, V., quit horsing around.

a horse, a horse, my kingdom for a
Otter

Chuck in Doha for All:

Also, I thought this USAToday opinion piece was interesting:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/usatoday/20060110/cm_usatoday/troublingtimesatroublingnominee

Basically, it looks at Alito from the perspective of searches and seizures without a warrant in the context of a presidency that probably really sees itself as, well, not so much above the law as beyond it.

Chuck in Doha

Back to billboards and SCOTUS, I hope our Senators use these hearings to get people on record as to where they stand on issues like whether or not it's OK for the Federal Government to conduct searches and seizures of US citizens with absolutely no oversight other than the whim of POTUS, especially in the context of this seemingly endless, twilight, semi-State-of-War we have been in for some six decades. Talk about your slippery slopes....

Once these things are on record -- we have to use them over and over and over. Two can play at that game.

Chuck in Doha

Okay, well, you see, I've got these pesky slippery slopes here, and...

Oh, wait. You didn't mean that literally.

Never mind.

dead hors d'oeuvres,
Otter

Chuck in Doha with one final thought on Alito and NSA spying on US citizens:

You know, what gets me about this is that, in the final analysis, all this fancy internal spying without even a warrant probably doesn't get us any significant increase in security. The "War on Terror" is not a war at all. I know people don't like to hear that. It is really a police action. These rings do not operate in the context of the nation state. They operate in the context of drug, people-smuggling, and other mafias. The only way to effectively deal with them is to increase procedural controls (e.g., flanging up and monitoring undeclared money, import/export or immigration controls), on the one hand, and inflitrating them, on the other. And such infiltration is actually, in my opinion, augmented by going through proper preparation, research, leg-work, ground-work, etc., of the sort that, as I undertand it, goes into obtaining a warrant.

It really does make me sick to hear people talk about how we need to give up our freedom in order to save it. Here we are, willing to trade in our birthright as US citizens, and I mean the Bill of Rights, for a foul-smelling mess of pottage, just because we allow ourselves to be scared of bogeymen. I am not saying that international terrorism isn't a real threat to our peace and prosperity; it is. And I just wish we would start doing something meaningful about it instead of just allowing our elected leaders to use it as a pretext to create an imperial presidency.

I wish our Senators would nail Alito down on that concept of spying and torture as the sole perogative of the Executive Branch (really, of the Chief Executive). If Alito comes clean on the right side, then we go after the current extra-legal activities of POTUS and add Alito's name to the list of supporters (loudly and publically). If he comes down on the wrong side, then we go after every person that voted to confirm him as a person that does not believe in the American Way, and is willing to trade in the Bill of Rights for ... almost nothing.

Chuck in Doha, stepping down of the soapbox.

PS: Whew. I feel a little better now. Back to work....

Chuck:

Nice.

:0)

a horse is a horse of course of course,
Otter

Posted by: Michelle at January 10, 2006 06:23 PM

Who is paying for the junket?

Will that mean he'll be out of town when the full Senate votes on Alito?

Posted by: Otter at January 10, 2006 08:55 PM

Gee, that sounds like The Cretin's administration. All hat, no horses (or cattle).... Just a fake bow-legged walk that makes him look like he has more than a little dangly thingy between his legs.

Thanks, Otter, and as to slippery slopes, well, that's something otters usually make good use of, followed by a refreshing splash.

Chuck in Doha

Chuck in Doha for NonnyO on the Kerry Itinerary:

I think by definition a "junket" is a trip by a government official on government business at public expense, so I guess it's paid for out of federal tax revenues. It ought to be anyhow (e.g., like a business trip in a corporation). That's a good question. I need to bone up on how the budget works. Boy, quite an itinerary though -- meeting with UK Labor Party No. 2 guy (and Blair's probable successor as the leader of the Labour Party), then Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, India, Kuwait, Jordan and Israel. Given that the Alito vote is scheduled for January 20, I wonder if he'll have to re-schedule? Lot's of these sorts of meetings have to be agreed well in advance. I bet his staff is scrambling right now.

Chuck in Doha

Laws? We don't need no stinkin' laws!

LAPD: Governor rode motorcycle illegally
Schwarzenegger, who hit car with son in sidecar, lacks proper license

SACRAMENTO, Calif. - Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger was riding his motorcycle illegally over the weekend when he collided with a car in his Los Angeles neighborhood, police said Tuesday.

Los Angles Police Lt. Paul Vernon said Schwarzenegger does not have the proper endorsement on his California driver’s license to operate a motorcycle.

Vernon said police did not ticket the governor for a violation because they arrived after the accident, which left Schwarzenegger with a cut on his upper lip that required 15 stitches.

-snip-

Earlier Tuesday, Schwarzenegger acknowledged that he never bothered to obtain a motorcycle license because he “never thought about it.”

“I just never really applied for it,” he told reporters during a state budget briefing. “It was just one of those things that I never really did.”

Schwarzenegger, a Harley Davidson owner who rides regularly along the California coast, said he had a motorcycle license when he lived in Europe, but never thought about getting another one after he arrived in the United States in 1968.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10794604/

Greenfield: Real questions for Alito
By Jeff Greenfield
CNN Senior Political Analyst

Wednesday, January 11, 2006

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- OK, one day of nomination hearings are enough. Clearly, we're not going to learn anything remotely useful about the legal philosophy of Judge Samuel Alito.

Democrats are spending their time painting the judge as a jurist who chuckles with amusement as jackbooted thugs strip-search innocent children and eject impoverished miners from their homes, all the while ripping giant holes in the Constitution.

Republicans are grasping Alito by the hand, leading him through gentle reassurances of his wisdom and probity. ("And didn't you always in every way act with total and complete integrity?")

And when the questions turn to matters of law or constitutional interpretation, Alito permits himself explosively shocking opinions: when the Supreme Court decides something, it's a precedent (duh!), or: "No one is above the law; no one is under the law." (Is anybody beside the law? Never mind.)

-snip-

The first kind asks for answers that offer a sense of a nominee's thinking without committing that nominee to any future rulings. For instance:

Everyone seems to agree it's wrong for judges to "legislate from the bench." Give us two or three examples from the court's past where, in your view, the court legislated from the bench.

Name two or three justices from the past whom you do not admire. Why not?

The Ninth Amendment says that the enumeration of certain rights [in the Constitution and the Bill of Rights] should not be held to disparage other rights... ." What does this mean?

Justice Scalia says that the court was wrong 80 years ago, when it began to apply the Bill of Rights to the states. Do you agree?

If a punishment -- say, branding or flogging -- was widely accepted at the time the Bill of Rights was written, could it be considered "cruel and unusual" today?

The second type of questions would give us a much broader sense of how a nominee thinks. For instance:

Favorite Beatle? (Paul means a right-brain view of things, John, a left-brain view. Ringo means outside the mainstream.)

Do you support the designated-hitter rule? (Yes means a pro-labor, pro-federalist outlook -- different rules for different leagues.)

Beer or wine? (populist vs. elitist)

Marital exception -- Halle Berry or Diane Lane? (Other answers acceptable, of course.)

Not only would these lines of questioning be far more revealing than the ones we've been listening to, they'd surely garner a much bigger audience.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/01/10/greenfield.alito/index.html

On JK, we understand he will cut short the trip for the Alito vote.

What is wrong with America that 42% think spying without a warrant is a-ok?!!! (From yahoo...42% agree with Bush on warrantless taping and 56% want a warrant.)

http://tinyurl.com/7cr9s

Ask any Republican who spoke to Duke Cunningham if they like having their conversations wired...though those were LEGAL wiretaps in that instance!

Bush to Democrats: Don't Chide Iraq Policy
Bush Warns Democrats About Criticizing Iraq Policy, Saying They Could Suffer at the Polls

By JENNIFER LOVEN
The Associated Press

WASHINGTON - President Bush, in full campaign mode, warned Democratic critics of his Iraq policy on Tuesday to watch what they say or risk giving "comfort to our adversaries" and suffering at the ballot box in November. Democrats said Bush should take his own advice.

There are 10 months before congressional elections in which polls indicate the president's Republican Party could lose its dominance of Capitol Hill. But Bush is wasting no time engaging the battle. In his first speech of 2006 on the road, last week in Chicago, he aggressively challenged Democrats on the economy.

Tuesday's equally sharp message represented an attempt by the president to neutralize Democrats' ability to use Iraq where violence is surging in the wake of December parliamentary elections and messy negotiations to form a new coalition government as an election-year cudgel against Republicans.

Bush acknowledged deep differences over Iraq among casualty-weary Americans, just 39 percent of whom approve of his handling of the war, according to a recent AP-Ipsos survey. Without specifically mentioning Democrats, the president urged campaigning politicians to "conduct this debate responsibly."

He said he welcomed "honest critics" who question the way the war is being conducted and the "loyal opposition" that points out what is wrong with his administration's approach.

But he termed irresponsible the "partisan critics who claim that we acted in Iraq because of oil or because of Israel or because we misled the American people," as well as "defeatists who refuse to see that anything is right. With that description, Bush lumped the many Democrats who have accused him of twisting pre-war intelligence with the few people, mostly outside the mainstream, who have raised the issues of oil and Israel.

Bush argued that irresponsible discussion harms the morale of troops overseas, emboldens the insurgents they are fighting and sets a bad example for Iraqis trying to establish a democratic government.

"In a free society, there's only one check on political speech and that's the judgment of the American people," the president said to sustained applause from a friendly audience, a gathering of Veterans of Foreign Wars. "So I ask all Americans to hold their elected leaders to account and demand a debate that brings credit to our democracy, not comfort to our adversaries."

White House press secretary Scott McClellan would not say who Bush believes has been irresponsible. In the past, the White House has singled out, among others, Rep. John Murtha, the Pennsylvania Democrat who became a leading advocate for a quick troop pullout, and Democratic Party chief Howard Dean, who said last month that "the idea that we're going to win this war ... is just plain wrong."

Democrats said Bush has no business trying to define what sort of talk is acceptable.

"Patriotic Americans will continue to ask the tough questions because our brave men and women in Iraq, their families and the American people deserve to know that their leaders are being held accountable," said Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev. "President Bush should join us in this open debate and dialogue to ensure that 2006 is a year of significant transition in Iraq so more of our brave troops can come home to their families."

Rep. Adam Schiff, D-Calif., who met with Bush recently at the White House, praised the president's recent efforts to gather differing viewpoints and welcomed the call for a more civil dialogue. But Schiff said the process must begin at the White House, which he said "brought the debate down a significant notch" when it attacked Murtha, a respected veteran and longtime hawk.

"Some of the worst culprits in worsening the dialogue on Iraq have come from the White House," said Schiff, who attended Bush's speech. "It's got to be a two-way street."

more...
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/print?id=1491398

Posted by: marc trager at January 11, 2006 08:29 AM

Marc,

I heard that on CNN radio on the way home. I'm just wondering why these people who didn't agree with Clinton's actions in Bosnia didn't duck-tape their mouths with their critism.

Though some say Clinton's actions were competent there, I know from one of my pre-election campaign calls that Bush has totally dropped the ball on Bosnia/Serbia and now the "good guys" (who we supported) are now doing the same thing those "bad guys" did...i.e. raping and killing civilians, burning churches, etc...

Just re-read this paragraph from the article above....

'But he termed irresponsible the "partisan critics who claim that we acted in Iraq because of oil or because of Israel or because we misled the American people," as well as "defeatists who refuse to see that anything is right. With that description, Bush lumped the many Democrats who have accused him of twisting pre-war intelligence with the few people, mostly outside the mainstream, who have raised the issues of oil and Israel.'

UMMMMMM, HELLO? Few people "outside the mainstream" have questioned whether this war of choice was for oil????

Are you friggin' kidding me?

And only Democrats are questioning the handling of pre-war intelligence??? That's news to me.

And finally, I know many rightwingnuts who have been arguing AT me since the war started that the TRUE reason we are there is to protect Israel from Iran.

Man, wait til I tell them they are outside the mainstream too... for the 50th time.

How 'bout that Liberal media, eh folks?

Marc,

It's like they get up each morning and draw a new excuse out of the hat...a new strategy. Today's strategy was that one--'out of the mainstream'.

But have you noticed, the "TRUTH" is never one used--or if it is used it's used as a means of begging for forgiveness for breaking the law in the name of 'national security'. It's used sparingly and in a manipulative way. Not because the truth just is...but because the rat is caught in the trap and wants you to look into his wiley eyes and let him go.

I'd rather pay my tax money for Kerry to travel and meet with world leaders than for Tom Delay to golf.

DiAnne:

That Kerry junket seems to be very appropriate to me. I don't see how congressional oversight can be conducted without trips like that, and they darn well should be federally funded. Business leaders do trips all the time and you can bet it doesn't come out of their pockets. And if it does come out of the pocket of, say, a supplier, then they are in big trouble. Business pays for the costs of doing business I don't see why the federal budget shouldn't pay for the cost of doing the business of the federal government. It's a lot cheaper than occupying foreign countries too!

Chuck in Doha

Also, the cost of going to Iraq is what brings about the accountablility. This is how Kerry KNEW the situation in Iraq last year. And it's how Murtha knew that things were so bad we should get out.

And it's how Leiberman knew they could use cell phones...such progress! Can leave your home, can't have the basics in life, but you can use a cell phone.

Notice, after the Congressman go, it's not too long after that that Bush leaves the White House too. He's a follower not a doer.