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Berlusconi Out
Second exit poll showing Silvio Berlusconi out as Prime Minister of Italy.
Reuters reporting Berlusconi out and Mediaset shares falling on the news.
The Guardian does a fine job of explaining the weirdness that is the complex political situation in Italy. (hat tip to Moonbootica)
And last but not least, meet Italy's new Prime Minister, Romano Prodi.
Wish we were having a national election today...
Posted by: madame defarge at April 10, 2006 11:13 AM
My Pet Vote
President George W. Bush acknowledged on Monday he ordered the declassification of parts of a prewar intelligence report on Iraq to respond to critics.
But Bush said he could not comment on an assertion that he authorized Vice President Dick Cheney's former top aide, Lewis "Scooter" Libby, to release the information to reporters. Libby is accused of obstruction of justice and perjury in an investigation designed to discover who leaked the name of a CIA operative.
"I will say this, that after we liberated Iraq, there was questions in peoples' minds about, you know, the basis upon which I made statements, in other words, going into Iraq," Bush said in his first words on the subject since it flared up last week.
Answering questions after a speech, Bush said he declassified an October 2002 National Intelligence Estimate in July 2003 for a reason.
"I wanted people to see what some of those statements were based on. I wanted people to see the truth. I thought it made sense for people to see the truth. That's why I declassified the document," he said.
http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Bush_acknwoledges_declassifying_Iraq_intelligence_ducks_0410.html
...there was questions in peoples' minds...
Posted by: monkey at April 10, 2006 12:06 PM
Yep, there was questions...like about his strategery...
Sheesh. What a moran...
Casey
One of the comments mentions that the media in Italy is very controlled. Could that be because Berlusconi is a media mogul. Can't say I'm sad to see this friend of Bush go. I think Italy actually has too low a birthrate to sustain the aging of it's "boomer" demographic, even though it's a Catholic country. That's one problem. Anyway, thanks for publicizing a foreign election. They're sort of a hobby of mine, and sometimes they're hopeful with respect to "people power."
By the way, here is something translated into English from a French site (www.dedefensa.org), about our candidates. It happened to agree perfectly with something a really astute amateur political analysist had just sent me. I put it into a file for "whenever" so guess the time is now. It's interesting sometimes to see how it looks from the outside.
» The ice is cracking. With half the nation backing ‘Bring-the-Boys-Home-by-Christmas,’ Democratic support for getting out must be in the 60 percent range. Kerry is moving to the base of his party, not away from it. He is kissing the Joe Lieberman wing goodbye. His decision reveals a political calculation that the only way to take the nomination from Hillary is to move left, ride the antiwar horse, and rally the Hollyleft and True Believers.
» In this huge sector of the Democratic Party there has been a vacuum, filled only by Rep. John Murtha and Sen. Russ Feingold. Now, every Democrat who sees himself as the alternative to Hillary is going to have to ask himself: What is the benefit of hanging back and standing with the Bush-Rumsfeld-Rice-Cheney stay-the-course policy? Mrs. Clinton has been here before — in 1968. The Democratic Party is now there again, and she is in the role of Hubert Humphrey, tied to an unpopular war, while Kerry, like Robert F. Kennedy, has just decided the antiwar camp is where the action and passions are. »
Of course, I don't believe Kerry is doing this because of mere political calculation. I just thought it was an interesting take, especially with the comparison to 1968, when I was working on the Eugene McCarthy campaign. That would make McCarthy the Russ Feingold, unless the comparison broke down.
I posted elsewhere that JK is trying to save the troops now the same as when he tried to bring the VN troops home in 1971.
The smearvets stabbed him in the back over it and he knows there will be more back-stabbing over this.
Compare this to Biden who is willing to allow more deaths because it is Dumbo's problem.
One wants to end death, one doesn't care as long as it makes Dumbo look bad.
As usual, JK has the greater public good at heart; Biden is out making reservations.
More foreign news relating to "people power" - after weeks of protest, the revision in French labor law for youth is not going to go through, apparently. This is a victory for the young, but the question remains, how is it to be paid for in the future, as demographics change and globalization marches on? They are also heading into an election next year, with polarization of the left and right & labor/immigration are central issues. The young did get the backing of all the major unions.
http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=topNews&storyID=2006-04-10T152612Z_01_L09541867_RTRUKOC_0_UK-FRANCE.xml
As Barbara Ehrenreich recently pointed out in the Guardian (she frequently writes about labor issues and is the woman who wrote "Nickle and Diming" - where she worked in Walmarts etc) - in US, workers are not protected much in terms of job security. You can lose your job for a "bad attitude" or something, and many hang on to bad jobs just for health care. We have already had alot of immigration and welfare reform. I think Europe is headed in the same direction & some has to happen because of demographics and costs. Some could have been avoided were not corporate heads to greedy and dependent on cheaper labor and Chinese goods. That is one reason why I can go to IKEA (Swedish) and get something made in Poland, or why a Euro store will have lots of Chinese goods, like a dollar store. That part has gone to an extreme and people are rebelling.
& as all the stories & comments at the end of the last section attest (along with the topic), it's happening here. Rebellion against policies which go to the extreme and invariably seem to benefit the bosses & stockholders, not the workers & their families & quality of life. We will have a demonstration in Seattle later today. I don't have a clue the size but will see.
Posted by: battlebob at April 10, 2006 12:25 PM
As usual, indeed.
It was a gutsy move. Telling the truth always is.
I just talked to student friends in France - they were happy about the labor bill stalling & also were nervous about Italy, saying that the left was ahead yesterday but the right was catching up today & they didn't know whether to trust the exit polls. Hope they don't have a replay of what happened here. They were encouraged by the Spanish elections & hope the right doesn't take over in France because of anti-immigration sentiment but think maybe that will turn back around in favor of a more liberal/Democratic government. It's fun to talk to those in their 20s. They are thinking ahead. That's also why I really enjoyed the Kos Q/A the other night. There was an emphasis on the future and even their children's (my grandchildren's - if I had them) future.
Jason Leopold: Bush and Cheney Discussed Plame Prior to Leak
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/041006Z.shtml
In early June 2003, Vice President Dick Cheney met with President Bush and told him that CIA officer Valerie Plame Wilson was the wife of Iraq war critic Joseph Wilson and that she was responsible for sending him on a fact-finding mission to Niger to check out reports about Iraq's attempt to purchase uranium from the African country, according to current and former White House officials and attorneys close to the investigation.
Elizabeth de la Vega | Final Jeopardy
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/041006P.shtml
Elizabeth de la Vega writes: On Friday, in a press conference that bore a striking similarity to Abbott and Costello's "Who's on First?" routine, President Bush's spokesman Scott McClellan dutifully responded to reporters' questions about the disclosure. No, the increasingly robotic McClellan said, the White House will not comment on an ongoing case. But, he assured the assembled journalists, the President can declassify whatever he wants, whenever he wants, however he wants. So, McClellan implied, it would have been perfectly legal for the President to have taken this action, which he could not, of course, comment on because this was an ongoing case (and so on).
Greg Palast | Gangster Government
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/041006N.shtml
Greg Palast writes: While Miller sat in a prison cell, Bush and Cheney were laughing their sick heads off, knowing the grand jury testimony, the special prosecutor's subpoenas and the FBI's terrorizing newsrooms were nothing but fake props in Bush's elaborate charade, Cheney's Big Con.
Christian Coalition Shrinks as Debt Grows
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/041006L.shtml
The once-mighty Christian Coalition, founded 17 years ago by the Rev. Pat Robertson as the political fundraising and lobbying engine of the Christian right, is more than $2 million in debt, beset by creditors' lawsuits and struggling to hold on to some of its state chapters.
US Propaganda Campaign Hypes al Qaeda Role in Iraq
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/041006J.shtml
Some senior intelligence officers believe Zarqawi's role may have been overemphasized by a propaganda campaign conducted by the US military, which has included leaflets, radio and television broadcasts, Internet postings and at least one leak to an American journalist.
Although not insincere, I think Russ Feingold is getting unduly canonized for his IWR voting, when he didn't the party support for an election Also his call for withdrawal saying he was first, and repeatedly. Media is using these tags. How can we again have them see the truth of all this, just for its own history of events.
Marjorie G
I think we need to focus on politicians taking a stand and include him in one who recently has, period. Don't get pulled into it.
ThinkProgress says FOX is spending more time on Cynthia McKinnon than on the Bush leak but we can reset the terms or frame in discussions with others. Howard Dean does a pretty good job of it - not letting him be cornered.
I think we can say "It's not about who was first. It's about getting the hell out of there."
My mom is on the phone - "Don't watch the news because it's bad. We can't do anything about warmongers. Kerry did get in a good lick this morning. It was on Good Morning America. It was just one little thing but they put it on. I could hear it in the bathroom and I knew it was him." See - that is in ND. She also says "I'm getting tired of all the nu-cu-lar bomb threat" and laughs.
Marjorie G
Call the media and yell!
I was up late last night, saw some overnight news that mentioned the Libby assertions. This morning I woke up early (not on purpose), so I did some channel surfing to see what infotainment "news" was saying.
I have been feeling surreal for the rest of the day, wondering if I was in the same country or not, and I may have a bruise by later this afternoon from pinching myself trying to wake up from the unreality of the morning "snooze." I'm either still asleep and in the middle of a nightmare, or else this foggy feeling in my brain means something I'm not yet aware of.
It was nice to see that the immigration demonstrations were covered. I'd like to see anti-war demonstrations of the same size, or impeachment demonstrations of the same size. Now that the weather is nicer, it would be comfortable for people to be outdoors.
The surreal part came when I couldn't find anything about the Libby story, nothing about the Vermont impeachment vote, nothing about the illegal wars in Iraq or Afghanistan. (I missed the Kerry segment on GMA spoken of above, or else it was on before I woke up about 8 a.m.) One of the networks (CBS?) did mention the weekend story about "secret" plans by the Bu$h administration to use a bunker buster nuclear bomb on Iran, mentioned briefly in passing, as though it was of no consequence - and no mention of the fact that the best estimates of when Iran could maybe have a nuclear bomb is at least ten years away. I know Congress is on a two-week Easter break, but why isn't anyone calling Dem legislators at home asking for their reaction to the idea of a nuclear bomb being dropped in Iran? Is no one horrified beyond belief at the mere idea of a nuclear holocaust (which would amount to mass genocide), let alone the potential reality which could become very real because of that paranoid psychopath "leading" this nation???
The morning infotainment shows were all perky and cheerful, like we don't have the mosted hated person on the planet as president of this nation, like our 'fearless leader' isn't considered a more dangerous threat to world peace than Al Qaida (per the BBC poll that will be broadcast, link a couple of threads back), as though the idea of using a nuclear bomb in Iran was nothing unusual or horrendous in its implications, like the "secret plan" is a done deal, and only the date needs to be decided on.
I find that quite astonishing.
RE: Immigration protests...They've really got the right idea and they're organized. Sure wish as many people would stand up in this country to protest & act against the war(s)... Over half a million protested in Dallas yesterday...
Thousands rally for immigrant rights
Nationwide protests set for Monday show increased coordination
Different organizers have different agendas, but they do agree on the need to convert energy from protests into massive voter registration drives.
Voter registration and citizenship education initiatives are set to begin in several states after a "Day Without An Immigrant" campaign planned for May 1, an event that asks immigrants nationwide to stay home from work and school, and refrain from buying U.S. products.
"Marches will only get you so far," said Armando Navarro, coordinator of the National Alliance for Human Rights, a network of Hispanic activist groups in Southern California. "There has to be an electoral component to get the Republicans out of the majority."
http://tinyurl.com/q28l3 = CNN
BTW, this is why I really dislike CNN...the way they phrase things really annoys the hell out of me, as if to cast doubt. Example: on the photo for this story, they say, "Beatrice Saldivar protests in Dallas, Texas, carrying a photo of a nephew she said was killed fighting in Iraq."
"She said was killed..." Who would lie about something like that? I met Beatrice at Camp Casey last summer and she's a huge part of the peace activities in the country, because of her nephew's death.
http://www.tompaine.com/articles/2006/04/10/blowing_cheneys_cover.php
Blowing Cheney's Cover
Ray McGovern
McGovern is one of the most lucid writers we have in today's insane world....
Posted by: madame defarge at April 10, 2006 03:29 PM
Actually, it's both racist and sexist. Racist because Ms. Salvidar's name is obviously Latino, and sexist in the 'she said' part means they also don't take her seriously because she's a woman - and a minority woman at that - and therefore lacks credibility and authority in CNN's world.
Perhaps, like Faux Snooze, CNN's "news" needs to be turned off....
Posted by: NonnyO at April 10, 2006 03:39 PM
McGovern is on a speaking tour right now...I'll be seeing him Thursday night locally; topic is "Speaking the Unspeakable" about torture.
(And you're right about CNN...never watch it; just check the online site once in awhile to see what crap they're spewing...)
NonnyO,
Read the Palast piece and the one about the Christian Coalition that you have the links posted to above.
I had no idea the Christian Coalition had distributed 70 million voter guides in 2000. Very interesting article. It appears they are having trouble keeping people motivated, since they pushed for seats on the Supreme Court and have had a bit of success.
Just because they are going broke, however, and Ralph Reed and Pat Robertson are no longer at the helm, doesn't mean we won't still see those types of voter guides going in to all those churches.
Hmm...I wonder who will be distributing them from now on....
Posted by: madame defarge at April 10, 2006 03:47 PM
It's about time someone spoke up about torture!!! It's a topic that horrifies me, makes me mortally ashamed to be an American, as I have previously written.
If there's a Q & A session, ask McGovern this on my behalf, please:
Bu$h's legal advisors are saying Geneva Convention does not apply at Guantanamo. (By implication I assume they also believe the Nuremberg judgment about torture being a war crime does not apply, too, although it was also determined at Nuremberg that invading another country without just cause is also a war crime.) Guantanamo is a US military base. What laws and/or treaties prevail on a US military base???
If torture is a war crime off of a US military base, isn't torture done on a US military base also a war crime???
That's an issue I've not yet seen anyone address in all these years. I would like an answer to that question. It would mean that the people who sanctioned and condoned torture could be charged and tried for war crimes....
Posted by: NonnyO at April 10, 2006 03:06 PM
Great post.
Couldn't have said it better myself... and if I had tried, few people would have gotten it anyway.
M.I. Nutts
Hey Nonny, here's some news from an alternate universe... read this gem and comment...
A Good Leak
President Bush declassified some of the intelligence he used to decide on war in Iraq. Is that a scandal?
Sunday, April 9, 2006
The Washington Post; B06
PRESIDENT BUSH was right to approve the declassification of parts of a National Intelligence Estimate about Iraq three years ago in order to make clear why he had believed that Saddam Hussein was seeking nuclear weapons. Presidents are authorized to declassify sensitive material, and the public benefits when they do. But the administration handled the release clumsily, exposing Mr. Bush to the hyperbolic charges of misconduct and hypocrisy that Democrats are leveling.
more...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/04/08/AR2006040800895_pf.html
Casey:
Looks like Berlusconi could be eking out a tie or a victory in the latest polls...
RU
Not okay to cherry-pick intelligence to sell the war and withhold, also from voting Senators, opposing views.
Nonny
Media has to be careful about declaring deaths, and are careful with obits, also.
Fe- It wouldn't be in the counting now would it?
monkey...
Editor & Publisher pretty thoroughly destroyed the WaPo editorial board for writing something that was so clearly wrong, pointing out that a news article in the very same edition of WaPo pointed out all the lies.
http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/columns/pressingissues_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1002314409
http://tinyurl.com/mfhx6
Josh at TPM also pointed out their complete idiocy...
EDITORIAL PAGES ARE for opinion. But legitimate opinion journalism is constrained by facts, as nearly as we can know them as we put pen to paper. And by that measure, the Washington Post's editorial page has skidded outside the boundaries of journalistic legitimacy on any number of issues but most glaringly on our involvement in the Middle East. Today's editorial on the Bush-Cheney-Libby leak of classified portions of the Iraq National Intelligence Estimate is a case in point.
One might simply say that presidents play hardball; and they play politics. And President Bush or his untethered vice president played hardball against a prominent critic by releasing information the law allowed them to release. And get over it. Politics, like life, isn't fair. And if you swipe at the president, expect to get hit back.
You may not agree with that. But it's an opinion. And it contains an uncomfortably large element of fact.
But the authors of this editorial don't appear to read the news pages of their own paper or their best competitors. The clock has simply run out on any attempt to claim the president and his key advisors weren't acting in bad faith with their constant advocacy of an alleged traffic in uranium between Iraq and Niger. It's over.
read the rest here...
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/008176.php
On NPR, Sylvia Poggioli is reporting that the Italian election looks like a virtual tie at this point. Said that it will depend on what type of alliance the larger parties can make with the smaller parties to see who can come up with a majority government.
Hello from London,
We just had a rehearsal for FEAR UP and it is looking good--at least better than Berlusconi is right now...The BBC seems to want him around though. Very positive reporting on him; and dismissal of Prodi. I am in an Internet cafe now, so I do not know the latest, but we were kind of surprised about the BBC's take.
On FEAR UP--the actors doing it this time around are quite good and very different from the DC production; which says to Marietta and me that the stories hold up even with very different takes. I am still moved by it, and that makes it all worthwhile.
It's FREEZING here.
Miss you all!
fe-mkh
Scary to think our horrible global systems voting machines are now being marketed everywhere, inlduing Europe.
Posted by: R.U. Nutts at April 10, 2006 04:44 PM
Since everything in that so-called 'classified' document had already been disproved as LIES by the time it was 'declassified,' I don't understand why the document was classified in the first place. (See the McGovern piece.)
The WAY it was "declassified" and "leaked" to that moron Miller, and published by Novak, to "disprove" Wilson and then out his wife, Plame, was totally wrong and broke federal laws, and that's the part that is the scandal (and there was a ten-day period between when it was leaked and when it was officially declassified). Wilson told the truth in the first place. So did Hans Blix and the other UN inspectors. There were no WMDs to begin with, no yellow-cake from the French companies who own the companies that sell it via Niger, and even those of us who didn't have a computer and access to internet news and heard those reports in passing on Lamestream Media TV snooze figured out right quick that there was NO BASIS for the illegal attack of Iraq, and it was all a pack of LIES concocted in the paranoid brain of the installed pResident (at that time - that was before the stolen election of '04). No one in Tweedle Dum and Tweedle Dee's administration EVER listens to people who tell the truth...!!!
That's why I'm so bloody upset with this talk about dropping a bomb on Iran. Even that made Lamestream Media TV morning snooze, and it was broadcast so casually it gives the impression someone in the administration already assumes they have the authority to drop a danged bomb, just based on their LYING (lack of) evidence and threats about and to Iran, when it's also been written that the soonest they could even have a nuclear bomb is ten years from now.
The opening of the Iranian Oil Bourse is more of a threat to US oil corporations than Iran the country or its people ever could possibly be. It was set to open in March, but was delayed until this fall. I'm assuming we're going to hear a lot more LIES about Iran from the paranoid twit who is trying to protect his family's money and his oil corporation buddies who all stand to lose a bundle if/when the IOB opens and they start trading in Euros rather than the paper dollar.... The Iraq Oil Bourse was closed with the illegal attack of Iraq....
Puh-leeze, will the House start IMPEACHEMENT proceedings SOON?!?!? I'm so danged sick and tired of this administration and it's CONSTANT stream of LIES (and waste of lives in their illegal wars and waste of money for same)...!
Posted by: monkey at April 10, 2006 04:36 PM
Thanks... and I did wonder for a while if I was toing nuts in recognizing the cognitive dissonance - the reality of the news stories I read last night before retiring vs. the cheery twittering on this morning's infotainment snooze shows (and the casual reference to dropping a nuclear bunker buster on Iran).
Can I puh-leeze wake up from this nightmare??? Seriously, where I pinched myself is turning purple, and I don't look good in purple....
From small-town newspaper, hattip to kos poster jim d --
The Tahlequah Daily Press
Tahlequah, OK (pop. 14,500)
Published: April 10, 2006 10:26 am
Can Bush get much lower?
As more details are brought to the fore about the seamy underbelly of the Bush administration, the perpetually trusting souls among the American electorate are having trouble keeping those scales firmly in place on their eyes.
The president has sunk so far down in the polls it’s hard to imagine he could get any lower without being adept at limbo dancing. And it’s no wonder: Even staunch loyalists are at pains to name one positive thing Bush has accomplished during his five years in office, except perhaps the seating of two new justices (presumed to be conservative by ardent Bush supporters, who could be sorely disappointed if they merely turn out to be fair).
The usual response from Bush fans, when asked such impertinent questions about their fearless leader, is to fire another accusatory salvo at his predecessor, whose peccadilloes are not only irrelevant to the situation at hand, but pale by comparison.
Bush’s “political missteps,” on the other hand, would fill several pages, even with small type. The senior citizens are having trouble with his Medicare program, and his fence-straddling on the immigration issue is ripping his own party apart. The cronies he empowered within FEMA dropped the ball in spectacular fashion when Hurricane Katrina roared through, and the fallout on that fiasco continues. The violence goes on unabated in Iraq, and Afghanistan is lurching toward a theocracy that Western states will ultimately find as unpalatable as Iran’s government. The national deficit has ballooned to incomprehensible levels, and the wages of the average Joe are stagnant. Philosophically, Americans are polarized, and not only do our fellow countrymen from the opposing party dislike us, but the rest of the world does, too.
And now, Bush himself has been identified as the ultimate source of the information leak that led to publication of supposed pre-war intelligence and the outing of CIA operative Valerie Plame. With all due respect to Gomer Pyle, and with as much sarcasm as can possibly be mustered: “Well, surprise, surprise, surprise!”
It seems that Scooter Libby – who went from bureaucrat to porn novelist to Dick Cheney’s top aide – is now squealing like a stuck pig from the muddy sty to which he’s been consigned. Intent on saving his own skin after being fingered in the information leak case, Libby (who probably has another book deal in the works) has turned on his former superiors and is giving them the biblical “pearl treatment.”
Libby told a grand jury he discussed pre-war intelligence with New York Times reporter Judith Miller, who dutifully printed the material. Now it’s been revealed that he had permission to flap his gums, by none other than Bush himself, through Cheney.
One can almost feel sorry for Scott McClellan, Bush’s hapless press secretary who got his post not through the grace of God or abundance of talent, but because his parents are old Texas barbecue buddies of Bush. But members of the White House press corps must have been thunderstruck when they heard the official spin on the story: The administration had “declassified” this information about the same time as Libby leaked it, and all for the good of the American people! Furthermore, McClellan asserted, the commander-in-chief has a right to leak information if he gets a hankering to do so.
Someone in this equation is destined to turn out stupid: The administration, for expecting the public to swallow this fish tale, or the public, for doing just that.
If the leaked information was declassified by the administration so Libby and others could hand it over to the media, then why didn’t they just say so to begin with? Why did they lie and say they knew nothing about it? Or, is McClellan the liar in this case?
To buy any of this, the public will have to suffer not just from pathological stupidity, but also from terminal amnesia. We’ll have to forget that Ms. Plame’s name only became public after her husband, former diplomat Joseph Wilson, disclosed that he could find no evidence of weapons of destruction in Iraq. We’ll also have to forget that several subsequent investigations have vindicated Wilson – which means the “declassified information” was completely erroneous, or a complete fabrication.
Regardless of what the Bush people call it, the “intelligence” was propelled forward on zeal for vendetta and a war of predestination to topple Saddam Hussein. Someday the truth will out, as well it should. It’s gotten an awful lot of people killed.
http://www.tahlequahdailypress.com/policeblotter/local_story_100102600.html?keyword=topstory
http://tinyurl.com/pcmej
Posted by: dwahzon at April 10, 2006 06:56 PM
Excellent article!!!
I just watched The News Hour and a debate about whether or not DumDum's threat to use nuclear bombs is real or not. Richard Perle was one of the people talking (he attacked Seymour Hersh, but the moderator was quick to point out that Hersh is not the only one who has written about this story lately), and I think the other fellow was named ?Herzog? He seemed Republican Lite somehow, didn't do much bleating against the idea of bombing - use diplomacy, threats, but don't take the option of bombing off the table. They're both pooh-poohing the whole idea that anyone would really use nuclear bombs - or any conventional bombs - and attack Iran without first exhausting all diplomatic channels... blah, blah, blah. In one of the cutaway pieces (think the fellow being interviewed was named Zinni?) the fellow was excitedly talking about war games he'd played, how an attack would/could be done (six or seven days/nights, take out missiles, plants producing WMD "oh, yeah, they have those, too" Zinni said, as well as the locations where they know nuclear facilities exist. I could barely believe the note of glee in his voice and the grin on his face as he was talking about the prospect of maybe bombing Iran.
Will people in the Western and Pacific time zones please watch and tell me if I was imagining that whole interview (it was like the third longer news story after immigration and a piece on the earthquake victims in Pakistan)?
Barring SOMEONE (Congress, when are you going to start impeachment proceedings?) stopping the maniac who's "leading" this country, as of this immediate second, I firmly believe The Cretin will bomb Iran at some point (nuclear and/or conventional weapons).
Deja voo-doo-doo - same as Iraq, just change the last letter of the name of the country, the advance warmongering rhetoric is the same.
http://tinyurl.com/nbnv4
Just in- the White House may be involved in phone jamming during the election
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060410/ap_on_el_se/lieberman
Lieberman Won't Rule Out Independent Bid
HARTFORD, Conn. - Sen. Joe Lieberman, facing a challenge from within the Democratic Party for renomination, said Monday he has not ruled out seeking a fourth term as an independent.
~~~~~
Ned Lamont, a Democratic activist and anti-war candidate from Greenwich, is challenging Lieberman for the party's nomination this year. He has been garnering support from some Connecticut Democrats dissatisfied with Lieberman's support of the war in Iraq and his perceived closeness with President Bush's administration.
The party will endorse a candidate at a convention on May 20.
{{{More on link. Hmmm.... let's keep May 20 in mind and see which one gets the CT Dem nomination... the Repub Lite candidate or the Dem challenger....}}}
"Democrats plan to ask a federal judge Tuesday to order GOP and White House officials to answer questions about the phone jamming in a civil lawsuit alleging voter fraud.
Repeated hang-up calls that jammed telephone lines at a Democratic get-out-the-vote center occurred in a Senate race in which Republican John Sununu defeated Democrat Jeanne Shaheen, 51 percent to 46 percent, on Nov. 5, 2002."
This one reminds me a bit of Watergate. It's overkill in the Republicans part, because Sununu would have probably taken the election even without the phone jamming. They just can't leave any election alone though- not even the ones that they're leading in.
Lieberman said he is not upset with fellow Democrats for opposing the war in Iraq. He, too, has criticized certain operations of the war and the Bush administration's handling of postwar Iraq, he said.
"I feel very strongly the world is safer without Saddam Hussein in power. We have to complete the job in Iraq," Lieberman said.
Just Bush It
Send your questions to Bill Keller, Executive Editor of the NY Times.
asktheeditors@nytimes.com
"I feel very strongly the world is safer without Saddam Hussein in power. We have to complete the job in Iraq," Lieberman said.
Posted by: monkey at April 10, 2006 08:27 PM
I've heard Lieberman say that same thing before (and I've heard DumDum and his cohorts say the same thing).
Wasn't there a better way to get Saddam out of office? Like, say, let the Iraqi people get him out, and the US mind its own business?
My question to the last part of that two sentence statement is: Complete WHAT job in Iraq? Nobody ever defines WHAT job 'we're' supposed to complete....
Exit Polls Show Italian Election Is Too Close to Call
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/041006T.shtml
Italy's elections narrowed this evening to a race too close to call, as projections showed Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi winning the upper chamber of parliament and in a tight race for the lower chamber. Full results were not expected until late into the night, and possibly not until Tuesday, and neither Mr. Berlusconi nor his opponent, former Prime Minister Romano Prodi, made any public statements.
CNN International Poll
Do you think the Bush administration is considering a military strike on Iran?
Yes 86%
No 14%
The world knows...
DiAnne, your liveblogging of the Crashing the Gate book event got mentioned in kos's current front page item...
Your blog thread is the hyperlink behind the words 'was blogged' in the following sentence:
We had close to 200 people show up, the event was blogged, and I was so pumped from meeting so many great people that a bunch of us headed out to a bar afterwards for a drink.
read the entire post here...
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/4/10/20817/0064
Quick comment that probably belongs on the previous thread but I just got here.
I experienced the protests all day and listened to incessant horn blowing - all f-ing day. I guess I just don't get it: why were the protestors waving MEXICAN flags? If I was a Mexican and wanted to be an American, I would wave an AMERICAN flag.
Some one please "'splain this to me, Lucy".
I have wondered the same thing myself. I get the feeling that it's more of a "I'm Mexican but I'm here to stay and you can just deal with it" attitude.
abqjohn- because a lot of these protesters want all the benefits of American citizenship but don't want to really "become" Americans. They want to bring their culture here rather than keep it in Mexico and assimilate into American society.
I'll probably be accused of being Republican on this one, but I was fairly sympathetic to the rights of most immigrants until about a week ago when all the demonstrations began, now I've gotten P.O'ed at these folks. I do believe we stole their land from them and then made non-citizens of their ancestors- the Mexicans were robbed of as much territory, or more than the native Americans. And, as I said, I've been fairly sympathetic to their coming across the border and working. I think there should be some provision for that to be allowed, but to march in the streets and DEMAND the rights of American citizens without being willing to go through the legal process really is the height of arrogance. And the bill that Ted Kennedy and John McCain tried to get passed last week had far too many hidden provisions in it that actually favored illegal immigrants over American citizens- including a provision for "in state" tuition for illegal immigrants. I can't, for the life of me, figure out why an illegal immigrant should get a better break on his college tuition than a kid who drives across the Ala-Fla line to go to school over here in Pensacola. Give me a break. My understanding is that the bill also provides an incentive for more American jobs in the computer industry, in particular, to be farmed out to foreign workers, and that pisses me off too. This bill really needs to be inspected much more carefully before we advocate passing it just because it seems like the "kind" thing to do. There's a lot of baloney attached to it.
Hey Linda
I agree with a lot of your observations because what I do for a living now is work with TANF (Temporary Assiatance to Needy Families - what used to be "welfare"). And yes, many of of our clients are Mexican. It's ok because of the TANF rules only give benefits to folks that show initiative - it is NOT A GIVEAWAY. "Welfare" was a giveaway and that's why TANF was implemented.
Linda, John,
I just wish it were easier to become an American citizen. My college-educated, English-speaking, wage-earning, European-descent father went through five years of paperwork and classes to become naturalized. He knows more about the Constitution as a result of that than most high school juniors in my AP Government class did.
If it's that hard for someone who fits in all the right Republican boxes to become a citizen (yes my father is a die-hard KoolAid drinking Republican) ... then is there any chance for everyone else?
And I have one other question on the immigration issue that I think is fair, but is not one that a lot of people want to face. Suppose, just suppose, that the Canadian economy went sour, and these were people from Quebec who came across our borders and took over jobs that Americans had been occupying- saying that they'd do it for less money. Would we be trying to pass laws in Congress to allow them to stay here , or would we be resentful and say "go back where you came from." My suspicion is that we'd be much less kind, because we'd know that our unkindness would not be taken as racism. I do think that the desire NOT to discriminate enters into this thing, and it really should not. Immigration laws are immigration laws, and they should be applied to citizens of all countries equally. Yes, we are a nation of immigrants,that much is true. And our country still accepts immigrants- but to accept an unlimited number each year would be insanity. And those who have broken the law for 5 years shouldn't be given any more rights than those who have only broken the law for 2 years. That just makes no sense at all to me.
I am going to do some more clandestine research tomorrow. Stay tuned but it may be Wed before I can get back.
Veritas- I'm not sure you have to pretend to be a Republican to attain American citizenship, but is it fair that your father, or my sister-in-law (who is Japanese) worked so hard to attain their citizenship and now the people who are demonstrating in the streets want all the rights of citizenship without doing anything to obtain it? My sister-in-law is an American Citizen, BTW, and she's ANYTHING but a Republican. This issue has a lot of pros and cons, and it can be argued both ways, I know that. But immigration laws are there for a reason, and quite frankly, breaking the law is breaking the law. We've overlooked illegal immigration as an issue for far too long, because so many American businessmen have been profiting from immigrants cheap labor for so many years. These same businessmen then grease the palms of the proper politicians and local authorities, and they overlook the problem. That's the only reason we have something like 11 million illegals in the country today. And I really don't buy the argument that Americans won't do the jobs that the illegals will do- what they won't do is the jobs for the same WAGE the illegal immigrants will do it for. That's always been the dirty little secret of it all. It just bothers me that it seems to be primarily the Democrats who are pushing for amnesty, when amnesty will mean the loss of jobs for a lot of American citizens who are living in poverty already. There are two sides to a lot of situations, and there are probably more than two to this one.
Just came from our Immigration rally here & felt probably the most patriotic I have in years and years. Now I will never again listen to comments about spreading freedom, liberty or democracy unless those talking can put their money where their mouth is. We are a nation of immigrants, the native Americans are the true Americans, and if these people who PARADED today rather than protest are already working in this country, our unemployment rate is low, they are mostly doing jobs that need to be done and that no one else wants to do, let them stay. We can't preach family values and break up families.
I will upload my photos later - I had a high vantage point and there were people as far as my eyes could see - babies, grandmas and all in-between - people in painting clothes who had rushed from work or dared to take time off. Flags everywhere, US and Mexican, image of Guadeloupe. Pride, hope and courage. I saw Yva Las Vegas, who recorded an album with Krist Novecelic of Nirvana (she is from Venezuela) - she was off to get a beer for the event.
What a day I will always remember and this has changed my perception of this country forever. When I went to San Diego for a conventon in November, I took the trolley to Tijuana by myself for 5 bucks. As usual, despite Mexico's poverty, I cried when i had to come back home. What some lack in material possessions they make up for in vivacity. I am proud to call them sisters and brothers and my mental image of what this country is has changed, just as it did after I saw the survivors of Hurricane Katrina, after I saw the aftermath of 9/11 and after the Vietnam and Iraq wars went on too long & people came back with long-term residual problems.
This country is not what is appears to be on the surface but what it really is can no longer be hidden or swept under the rug. If voters are disenfranchised, if the media lies, if even the highest officials in the land keep us in the dark and mislead, they cannot change what is actually true.
Linda Enterkin
There are very few chances for green cards and citizenships each year.
Our protesters were waving mostly American flags.
Our city is inclusive. Let's see how people like paying more for their food, childcare and healthcare once these people are gone.
Let's see how they like paying more for landscaping and construction and letting their fruits and vegetables rot.
Bush acknowledges declassifying Iraq intelligence
By Steve Holland
"I wanted people to see what some of those statements were based on. I wanted people to see the truth. I thought it made sense for people to see the truth. That's why I declassified the document," he said.
He is such a f'ing liar. We all know why he declassified the documents, and it had absolutely nothing to do with telling the truth. I seem to recall his righteous indignation when he spoke out against the information in those documents being publicized. No doubt about it, he is a f'ing liar.
http://tinyurl.com/nlxxg
Not only that, the only truth that was disclosed was the name and cover of a C.I.A. agent and her cover company. I would like to know how that particular infomation influenced our citizens's understanding of why we invaded Iraq? If he thinks that helped us to better understand his reason for going to war, then he thinks we are all as delusional as he is.
NonnyO
My friend in Mpls reported some overlap between the antiwar and immigrant rights rallies. There are many areas of common ground. I'd like to see a unified peace and justice movement.
Dwahzon
Thanks for telling me about the Kos thing. I thought about cross-posting it over there but wasn't sure how and wasn't sure it'd be appropriate.
Re the immigrants and flags and attitude:
The not-wanting-to-assimilate sounds more like some of the ones in France Andree has told me about, which ends up causing trouble and bad sentiment.
The thing is, I got the complete opposite perception about our rally. I'm uploading my photos right now & I'll put some up on Bert & my website & I'll share some with this site if there is an appropriate way to do it.
Berlesconni has a terrible reputation in this country and his opponent was all ready to declare victory. Then, more votes started rolling in and now it is considered too close to call.
Sound familiar?
Oncall
The Berlusconi thing sounds horribly familiar.
As I mentioned earlier, my friends in France today were afraid this could happen. Here one party is leading in the exit polls, then suddenly there is just this SURGE of rightwing voters.
Oh man.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060411/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_iran
Bush Dismisses Reports Iran Attack Planned
WASHINGTON - President Bush dismissed as "wild speculation" reports that the administration was planning for a military strike against Iran.
Bush did not rule out the use of force, but he said he would continue to use diplomatic pressure to prevent Iran from gaining a nuclear weapon or the know-how and technology to make one.
"I know here in Washington prevention means force," Bush said at the Paul H. Nitze School of Advanced International Studies at Johns Hopkins University. "It doesn't mean force, necessarily. In this case, it means diplomacy."
~~~~~
Bush has said Iran may pose the greatest challenge to the United States of any other country in the world. And while he has stressed that diplomacy is always preferable, he has defended his administration's strike-first policy against terrorists and other enemies.
"The threat from Iran is, of course, their stated objective to destroy our strong ally Israel," Bush said last month in Cleveland. "That's a threat, a serious threat. It's a threat to world peace; it's a threat, in essence, to a strong alliance. I made it clear, I'll make it clear again, that we will use military might to protect our ally."
~~~~~ More on link....
{{{Okay. So how was that again? First Iran is a threat because it's trying to build a bomb (which it likely can't do for another ten years, you fool). Then Iran is a threat because its stated objective is to destroy Israel, our 'strong ally' and you will protect our ally. In the past you've mentioned you want regime change in Iran, just as you insisted on regime change in Iraq. So, what's the real reason you want to bomb Iran??? (Or is there another reason besides the one you haven't mentioned yet: OIL, and American oil corporations losing money if/when the Iranian Oil Bourse opens???) And you said you read the articles about your intent to bomb Iran and now you say that was "wild speculation." So, if nobody ever mentioned a "noo-cu-ler" bomb buster, how is it the story could leak from somewhere inside the White House? If you had never mentioned bombing Iran in any way, shape or form, "noo-cu-ler" or otherwise, it would never have crossed anyone's mind to do so, or that you might, so why is it common knowledge you want to bomb Iran, and you are still being a shoot-from-the-hip cowboy and posing and threatening dire consequences for Iran??? I've watched three re-runs of your speech over the weekend where you were saying the articles about a nuke attack on Iran are "wild speculation"... (cough) LIAR!!! (cough).... Sure, I believe every LYING word out of your little pit viper mouth as you were slithering on stage with your LYING body language... (cough) LIAR!!! (cough).}}}
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060409/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq_post_saddam_sculpture
New Baghdad Sculpture Holds Little Meaning
{{{Oooohhhh, zingers from Iraqi citizens! Was anyone aware a new statue had been put up to replace the Saddam statue to "celebrate Freedom Day" - the day The Cretin invaded Iraq??? It's news to me....}}}
Just some random observations on immigration.For starters, having seen the process up close, as a sponsper of a legal immigrate, the Dept of Immigration is a mess. They can't find a piece of paper to save their lives, and often demand that you bring papers they never ask for. It has become increasing difficult for even legal immigrates. Any discussion of immigration must include some way to streamline that Department. (why does it not surprise me to know that it is a divison of the Dept of Homeland Security?)
Here in the southwest it does seem as though many of the Hispanic don't want to assimalate, at least not in the sense that my mother did 90 years ago. Then the issue was not would she learn English, but would she even remember her native language. She didn't by the way, at least not by the time I came along. Here in Tucson it is almost mandatory to speak enough Spanish to order a hamburger, and if you want a decent burrito it is mandatory!
All that being said, Dianne makes a fair point, they do contribute to the ecomomy. Guest workers sounds good on the face, but the more I read about how it works in other countries, Arab nations, and some parts of Europe, the worse it sounds. It seems to create a class of workers who are disatisfed, under paid, and alienated from the country they are in.
Perhaps the solution lies in more flexiable policies, allowing for working visas in good times, and cutting them off if unemployment reaches a certian level. Those working on said visas should declare their intention to either stay and work towards citienship, or admit that they only want a couple of years,, perhaps showing that they have propects of employment.In both cases documents could be issued that allow the worker to pay
taxes, bank, rent housing, and all the other things that their current status makes so difficult. Surly it would be of enormous value to lift quotas on both Mexico and perhaps other South America countries. China might also be included in this, they too are swelling the ranks of illegals.
None of these are elegant solutions, the issue should have been addressed years ago, it too late for elegant solutions, but maybe we can work towards viable ones.
Posted by: oncall at April 10, 2006 11:25 PM
Is this explanation given by Bush today supposed to confuse the issue? Is it supposed to make people think all Bush did was declassify documents to show the American people how he reached his decision to go to war with Iraq?
Is it supposed to cloud the issue that he authorized the leak to out a CIA operative and put her and others in serious risk?
Really torks me off. I am so tired of this shifty lying weasle administration.
Got home very late and caught a few seconds of seeing the protests that went on all over the country today re: immigration.
They showed masses of people. Is there some real good reason why the media shows the large masses of protestors regarding immigration, and seems to be reporting the crowd sizes pretty accurately, but yet they won't show or tell about the actual size of anti-war rallys?
Could it be because the neocons want the size of the protests to be broadcast, and don't want the size of anti-war rallys reported accurately?
I don't think the neocons care about the immigration debate. It is an election year, so they are pretending to care. They have benefited greatly from the cheap labor they get from the immigrants.
Truth Shall Prevail
I don't trust the neocons for any of the numbers.
The figures I saw for our rally were local reporters and they estimated with helicopters, plus I was there & made my own estimates from up high.
I think any kind of people power scares the neocons, yet it's so ironic as they claim to want to spread democracy.
There are many kinds of immigration plans but i just can't see people who have paid taxes for years being deported, or people who perhaps give a lift or a little water to a worker possibly being a felon, families being separated, and if anyone gets screwed over in an election year, it will be these poor people.
I do believe that immigrants and refugees should be working at something, but I think America has done fairly well in this respect. Our geography is such that we are the greatest magnet to Mexico because it's on our border and is so much poorer, but the bosses have also exploited the workers. We need something fair for all and I like to hear it from those who are actually affected the most - the immigrants. If they are willing to take it the streets en masses, I think we should listen to what they are saying. I spent all day listening.
Posted by: NonnyO at April 11, 2006 01:02 AM
Deja vu.....
Okay, follow me here.....A few months ago I heard something in the MSM about a plan by Bush and the hawks to strike Iran. During that same time Bush went on tv and said no attack was planned, but that all options were on the table.
Now we are hearing again that there is a plan by Bush and the hawks to strike Iran. Once again Bush came out and said diplomacy will be tried first.
Yes, guest workers do contribute to the economy. They take jobs that pay so little (because Americans want near-slave labor) that Americans won't take those jobs. But I can't be convinced that Americans wouldn't pick fruit if they were given enough pay- there are Americans pouring asphalt down the road from my house right now, and clearing drainage ditches, because they're government employees and get decent pay and benefits. The argument that we need immigrant labor to do our dirty work just isn't so- there are millions of Americans doing dirty work already- and they're doing it because they can support their families with their paychecks. The problem is employers who want the cheapest labor possible- and we hate them when they open sweat shops overseas. Why is it that when they hire illegal immigrants here in our own country, we're trying to make it easier for them to do it?
I'll be honest in saying I think it's because we're trying to bend over backwards to not discriminate. And, for what it's worth, it's fairly easy to argue for open borders when you live in a part of the country that immigration doesn't affect. If you live in Texas or Florida you might have a different opinion of it- especially if your child goes in to apply for a job and can't get decent pay because the employer is only looking for someone who will work for substandard wages. The issue isn't simply one of being an immigrant nation and being open to other immigrants- it's very complicated. And the bills being rushed into congress right now are just that- bills being hurried. There's a lot of stuff in them that doesn't need to be there.
Phoenix immmigration marches...
Officials say more then 100k...organizers say 200-250k.
http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0411march.html
One of the organizers is one who I know well...His words should be heeded...
[snip]
Speeches continued for more than an hour before former state lawmaker and onetime Democratic gubernatorial hopeful Alfredo Gutierrez closed the rally.
"We shall arm ourselves, and in America, the only weapon that counts is the vote," Gutierrez said. "Be prepared to defeat those who humiliate us and defend those who stand with us."
Linda,
In Phoenix, we saw direct discrimination in favor of Latinos. In many cases, if a help wanted sign was on a restaurant window run by Latinos, only Latinos would be hired. If non Latinos applied, they would not be hired.
If the job is worth doing, it is at least worth minimum wage. Medical should be a universal right; not a benefit for the rich.
Employers that hire illegal workers need to be heavily fined.
The right-wingnut bills do not take into account illegal workers that had kids here; who are American citizens by birth. There is no way their bill can be implemented. No one knows who the illegal folks are and it they did, it would take a line of busses from San Diego to Alaska. Mass deportations are out of the question.
We need to secure the borders and if that means a fence then so be it. Have a lot of controlled entry points where a quick physical and SS cards are issued. Many illegal folks give a bogus SS number and are screwing up the accounts for the rest of us.
I want those who come up with these plans to say something about how their plan would be implemented.
The Kennedy-McCain plan is pretty good as it recognizes people who are working can stay. I don’t like the fine or back taxes as they won’t have the money for the former and the records for the latter. If the idea is to get them into the system then remove bogus hurdles.
The Kyl bill having folks leave then return is idiotic at best and is designed to placate the right wingnuts. It will not solve any issue except build a fence.
The Kennedy-McCain plan is pretty good as it recognizes people who are working can stay. I don’t like the fine or back taxes as they won’t have the money for the former and the records for the latter. If the idea is to get them into the system then remove bogus hurdles.
Posted by: battlebob at April 11, 2006 07:39 AM
I agree with you, battlebob, for the most part... The Kennedy-McCain bill seems pretty reasonable and yes, it does place some high hurdles in the way of getting to citizenship -- paying fines, back taxes, and having a clean record. But they are probably necessary to prove their resolve. (I wonder how many Americans would be willing to clear those hurdles to achieve whatever they wanted...)
Iraq fails to resolve deadlock over new government
BAGHDAD, Iraq (AP) -- Shiite politicians failed Tuesday to resolve the deadlock over the formation of the new Iraqi government after meeting to discuss the opposition of Sunni and Kurdish parties to the Shiite nominee for prime minister.
Prime Minister Ibrahim al-Jaafari's own Dawa party and his key backer, radical cleric Muqtada al-Sadr, continued to stand behind him, said Bassem Sharif, who attended the meeting of seven Shiite factions. Some Shiite officials even suggested the alliance block Sunni and Kurdish candidates for key posts if they do not accept al-Jaafari.
Sunni and Kurdish politicians said divisions within the Shiite alliance were making it difficult for the bloc to resolve the issue of al-Jaafari. These include a bitter rivalry between al-Sadr's group and the biggest Shiite party, the Supreme Council for the Islamic Revolution in Iraq, or SCIRI.
"They are divided and that is the reason why they are not able to reach a quick decision on the candidate," said Mahmoud Othman, an elder Kurdish statesman.
He said delays were "having a negative impact on the Iraqi people and ... badly affecting the credibility of politicians in front of the masses."
The Shiite politicians were to meet again Wednesday, Sharif said.
Al-Jaafari won the nomination of the Shiite alliance in balloting last February. But Sunni and Kurdish parties, whom the Shiites need as partners in a national unity government, have refused to accept al-Jaafari.
Sunnis and Kurds blame al-Jaafari for the rise in sectarian tensions and for a high-handed leadership style since he assumed office last year.
more...
http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/04/11/iraq.ap/index.html
(CBS) Continued dissatisfaction with President Bush and the Iraq war could spell trouble for Republicans in the fall congressional elections.
More than one-third of voters in a CBS News poll say they will think of their vote as a vote against Mr. Bush, while just 14 percent will think of it as a vote for him. Forty-five percent say their view of the president will not be a factor in how they vote.
Those numbers contrast sharply with the run-up to the 2002 midterm elections, in which Republicans won historic gains. Four years ago, 31 percent said their vote would be made in support of the president, versus just 19 percent who thought of their vote as a statement against him.
This year, as Democrats seek to wrest control of both the House and the Senate from the GOP, an endorsement from the president could actually do more harm than good for a candidate. Only 10 percent of voters say they'd be more likely to support a candidate backed by the president, while three times as many, 31 percent, would be less likely to support one.
more...
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/04/10/opinion/polls/main1486277.shtml
I don't like to push dailykos diaries over here too much but this one is very well-done. Sort of sums up the Bushjr obsession with Iraq and doing better than Daddy did in a very powerful way.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/4/11/8625/65059
Hey Italy!
If you can't figure all this election result stuff out, call the Supreme Court of the United States at 1-800-WEFIXEM... they love the help with stuff like that.
Ciao!
Ban Snooping, Not Speech
Can it be illegal to disclose an illegally taped call if you're not the one who intercepted it.
THE U.S. COURT of Appeals for the D.C. Circuit issued a troubling opinion last week in a case involving two prominent Republican leaders in the House of Representatives -- one who preceded and one who came after Tom DeLay.
The case involves the illegal interception of a cell phone call featuring then-House Speaker Newt Gingrich by a Florida couple in 1996 and the disclosure of its contents to the New York Times by Rep. Jim McDermott (D-Wash.), to whom they gave a tape.
One of the participants in the call was the man who recently became House majority leader, Rep. John A. Boehner (R-Ohio). He sued Mr. McDermott under a law that forbids unauthorized recording of telephone communications or the disclosure of such recordings. The case has been kicking around for years, but the D.C. Circuit by a divided vote recently handed Mr. Boehner a big and dangerous win.
The Supreme Court has addressed this question before, in a 2001 case similar to the Boehner-McDermott fight. In that case, the court wrote that "a stranger's illegal conduct does not suffice to remove the First Amendment shield from speech about a matter of public concern." Yet the D.C. Circuit contends that this case is different because Mr. McDermott knew the tape had been made illegally -- whereas in the high court's case, the person who passed it along had received it anonymously.
Yet, as Judge David B. Sentelle argued in a compelling dissent, this distinction is far less clear than it may seem. For one thing, the tape in the Supreme Court's case quite clearly had been illegally recorded as well. What's more, Judge Sentelle rightly points out that under the majority's reading, the newspapers that published the story were just as legally culpable as Mr. McDermott: "For that matter, every reader of the information in the newspapers also learned that it had been obtained by unlawful intercept," so any of these readers would violate the same law if they "communicate[d] on this topic of public interest because of the defect in the chain of title."
This ruling can't be right; the full court ought to intervene.
The full text of the Washington Post editorial may be found at:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/04/07/AR2006040701722_pf.html
Mayor: Cheney was shot accidentally years ago
VP wasn’t hurt by errant shotgun blast during hunting trip, Forrest says
ALBUQUERQUE - Years before Vice President Dick Cheney accidentally shot a lawyer during a Texas quail hunt, Cheney himself was on the receiving end of an errant shotgun blast.
Carlsbad Mayor Bob Forrest said he doesn’t know for certain if he or his twin brother, Dick Forrest, fired the shot during the hunting trip in the late 1990s. It accidentally pelted Cheney, who was then chief executive at Halliburton Co.
“We’re probably the only twins in the United States that have shot the vice president and never have gone to jail,” Forrest joked. The Albuquerque Journal reported the incident Sunday.
Cheney wasn’t hurt but he was miffed, Forrest told the Journal.
“He said, ‘You guys watch where you’re shooting!’ He was very offended,” Forrest said.
The hunting group included the Forrest twins, Cheney and Sen. Pete Domenici, R-N.M. They were hunting on a southern New Mexico ranch owned by the late Colin McMillan, an assistant secretary of defense under President George H.W. Bush, Forrest said. He said the senator wasn’t the shooter.
more...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12261789/
"We shall arm ourselves, and in America, the only weapon that counts is the vote," Gutierrez said. "Be prepared to defeat those who humiliate us and defend those who stand with us."
Posted by: battlebob at April 11, 2006 07:23 AM
Well some of were registering voters out there yesterday - in 8 languages, & wearing John Kerry hats.
benson today:
http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/opinions/benson/
Madame, this one's for you...
Chicago Trib editorial board throws Administration under a bus
by dmsilev
Tue Apr 11, 2006 at 07:53:21 AM EST
Anyone familiar with the Chicago newspapers knows that the Chicago Tribune's editorial board is only slightly to the left of the Wall Street Journal. They've been administration apologists for the last several years, on a wide variety subjects. That's why I was gobsmacked to read the lead editorial in this morning's paper.
The editorial has the blunt title of
Answers, Mr. Cheney
and it's the strongest denunciation of both Cheney and the rest of the administration that I've ever see from the Trib.
~snip~
First off, we have the acknowledgment that Fox News shills for the administration. Not news to us, to be sure, but it's hardly the sort of thing that you'd expect a conservative editorial board to lead with.
~snip~
Attention: Washington Post editorial board. When even the Chicago Tribune is seeing reality, you really really should reconsider your stance.
The Trib gives two possible rationales for the leak. Neither is particularly favorable for the administration:
~snip~
read the diary here...
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/4/11/85321/0483
and the Chicago Tribune editorial here...
http://tinyurl.com/g9k69
A poem written by a friend of mine...
To Seek the Truth
by C. Uhl
4/11/2006
We most humble men are served by fate
A drink so foul it shall not quench our thirst
And food like bile is that unto our mouths.
We have such thirst and hunger for but truth.
For truth is scarce among these men whose time
Shall torment us for untold days and more.
They do not represent the truth required.
Demanded once but now we're struck to starve
And lament upon our starvation, choke.
For we, most humble men, we are not starved
For water or for bread or meat must taste,
But truth and freedom, liberty we seek.
Our fathers' fathers fought for it in wars,
Untold dread, unspeakable affairs.
Yet now these righteous men do starve us so
Of those things I have told you here about.
When will our will be strong enough to cry
And shriek for liberty. Why have we not?
'Tis too easy to let them rule these men
Who speak with such a tongue to ease our thirst.
With such a tongue as a serpent, did Eve
and Adam tempt to taste the fruit forbade.
Wealth and comfort stop us to surmise
That these men, evil dwells within their souls.
Andree just mentioned this & now I see it:
Overseas ballots counted in Italian election
http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory?id=1829185
They wanted Berlusconi out, & being out of the country, are less captive to his self-owned media empire.
I know that Democrats Abroad and many others were similarly a positive factor in our last election and worked very hard. Unfortunately, they could do nothing about Diebold in Ohio, so the fix was in.
Posted by: Linda Enterkin at April 11, 2006 07:21 AM
Linda, I absolutely agree.
I lived in a part of the country where the immigrant problem RUINED opportunity for MANY U.S. citizens to provide a decent standard of living for their families.
The influx of illegal immigrants more than tripled rent, utilities, and other consumer goods in the Reno, NV area. Land and home prices soared. The immigrants will live eight to twelve people in an apartment, and will pay whatever it takes to do it. There used to be 10,000 people in the valley I grew up in. Now there are well over 700,000. The roads and highways are congested withtraffic.
The immigrants flooded into California, and drove many out of California into Nevada. Plus they theselves have flooded into Nevada.
Many, the majority of the ones I dealt with, are rude and have an attitude of entitlement.
It sounds good to say "Let the whole world come in, this country was founded by immigrants." Realistically, we need to be careful not to ruin our children's opportunities. We simply don't have enough to save the entire world.
Call me selfish, but Reno was my home. I can no longer afford, as a single woman, to live there, unless I want to share expenses with four other people in the same dwelling. I think we need to take care of our U.S. citizens first.
It's all about supply and demand.
They also put a terrible strain on our social services programs.
Do they pay taxes? So many of them, just as you say Linda, are willing to work for substandard wages, and settle for jobs that do not offer benefits. So that makes it hard for citizens to demand fair pay and benefits.
I don't care what anybody says, they have lessened opportunity and the standard of living that was there in years past. It hasn't been a good thing.
They have helped the corporation's bottom line. But they have hurt the working man. I think they should make themselves legal, and should be required to learn and use English.
Posted by: dwahzon at April 11, 2006 09:45 AM
Thanks, dwahzon. I did see that. Doesn't change my mind though about resubscribing to the Trib. (although I do check the online version once in awhile...) I'll only *consider* a subscription again when they get rid of Dennis Byrne (an extremely obnoxious right wing pundit that I'm sure is related to Rush) and when the Trib endorses a Democratic candidate for US president four times in a row (to make up for the 2 back-to-back endorsements of Clueless George). In spite of what (some) people say, I'm just not that easy...
Benson is great
http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/opinions/benson/