DCP ANNUAL MEETING - JULY 21-23, 2006 - ST. PAUL, MN

Bush, 9/2004:

And as a result of the United States military, Taliban no longer is in existence. And the people of Afghanistan are now free. (Applause.) In other words when you say something as President you better make it clear so everybody understands what you're saying, and you better mean what you say.

I understand what he's saying, and it seems pretty clear to me. No. More. Taliban.

Tony Snow, today:

BLITZER: Let's move on and talk about some other issues. I know your time is limited. Afghanistan. Is the Taliban making a serious comeback right now?

SNOW: I think what the Taliban is doing -- and it's predictable -- is that they are trying to test in the south, where the U.S. forces are handing over to NATO...But A, it's predictable, and B, in the encounters, as you know, the Taliban fighters have overwhelmingly been losing. Now, I think it is predictable...you can expect there to be pushback by the Taliban.

http://www.dailykos.com - main page

Hope everyone saw this (on Rove):

MURTHA: He's in New Hampshire. He's making a political speech. He's sitting in his air-conditioned office on his big, fat backside-saying stay the course. That's not a plan! We've got to change direction. You can't sit there in the air-conditioned office and tell troops carrying seventy pounds on their backs, inside these armored vessels-hit with IED's every day-seeing their friends blown up-their buddies blown up-and he says stay the course? Easy to say that from Washington, DC.

(text from Daily Kos site & heard elsewhere yesterday)

Zoellick resigning from State Department
Rice praises her second-in-command's ‘tireless work ethic'

Updated: 39 minutes ago

(AP) WASHINGTON - Deputy Secretary of State Robert Zoellick, the department's No. 2 official, is resigning, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice announced Monday.

Rice praised Zoellick's "tireless work ethic," and said he had served as her "alter ego" in the department. She did not announce a replacement.

"Our nation is stronger and safer because of your work," Rice said at a State Department announcement.

"I appreciate your confidence and friendship," Zoellick replied.

Zoellick, who served six years in the Bush administration, said he would join the Wall Street investment house Goldman Sachs Group Inc.

In his resignation letter, dated June 15, Zoellick, 52, did not say why he was leaving. A former U.S. trade representative, Zoellick reportedly wanted to be promoted to treasury secretary to replace departing secretary John Snow, but President Bush nominated Goldman Sachs executive Henry Paulson instead.

more...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13416533/

Bank shot.

Corporations are donating to Democrats more than Republicans now.

http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Donations_by_corporations_shift_from_right_0619.html

I personally wish they would not donate to either and let the lobbyists and donations stay out of both parties.

From the previous thread:

I spent some time listening to Rick Steves this weekend (the travel guru), when he appeared with Congressman McDermott. He had alot to say about our media, the fearmongering by the government & how it's used to control & the impression others now have of us in other parts of the world, plus how much freedom & liberty has already eroded in our country in a very short time.

Posted by: DiAnne at June 19, 2006 12:39 AM

I am a big fan of Rick Steves' travel products, and I know that he used to be a hardcore Reagan supporter. His change of heart came from his travels in Europe, which gave him a different perspective to observe the world (and America) from.

For example, he's learned that whenever he bragged about American gold medals at the Olympics, he would be told by his Dutch friend that the Dutch got five times more gold medals per capita. When he was in Norway watching the Apollo moon landing and saw it as an American accomplishment, his Norwegian cousins reminded him that it was an accomplishment for ALL of mankind. And of course, he's grown very fond of European social democracy systems, even as he admits that it'd be much harder to run his business in Europe than in the US.

Whenever I read about how he's changed through his travels, I am reminded that it's my own set of travels that has changed my political and social outlook as well. If I had not made those trips to Europe in my college years, and observed a different value system that exists there, I may still be a hardcore Republican today.

I may still be a hardcore Republican today.

Posted by: Ally McLesbian at June 19, 2006 11:01 AM

Nahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

I hope that isn't the week I have to work at camp. (Mpls)
It probably is. I'll check tomorrow.

from Think Progress:

POLITICS
And For Which It Stands

The U.S. Congress is closer than ever to passing a constitutional amendment that would criminalize desecration of the U.S. flag. If successful, it will mark the first time in 214 years that the Bill of Rights has been restricted by a constitutional amendment, and will place the United States among a select group of nations that have banned flag desecration, including Cuba, China, Iran, and Iraq under Saddam Hussein. The amendment has already been approved by the necessary two-thirds majority in the House of Representatives, and last week it passed the Senate Judiciary Committee on a near-party line 11-7 vote. Now, aided by a handful of Democrats, the amendment has gathered 66 votes in favor, just one shy of passage. "Whether advocates can find the 67th vote to send the flag amendment to the states for ratification remains unclear." The Senate vote is expected next week. Take a stand now by signing up with Veterans Defending the Bill of Rights.

DEFENDING THE FLAG, AND FOR WHICH IT STANDS: Defacing a flag is an act that most Americans find offensive and outrageous. It is also "an act of protected speech under the First Amendment to the United States Constitution," as established by the Supreme Court in Texas v. Johnson, 491 U.S. 397 (1989), and reaffirmed in U.S. v. Eichman, 496 U.S. 310 (1990). It takes no courage to stand for freedom of speech for the views with which we agree. Rather, favoring freedom of speech means favoring freedom of speech precisely for those views one finds offensive and outrageous. As Colin Powell has said of the First Amendment, affirming his opposition to a flag-burning amendment, "I would not amend that great shield of democracy to hammer a few miscreants. The flag will be flying proudly long after they have slunk away."

SOLVING A NON-PROBLEM: Amendment supporters seek to restrict the Bill of Rights despite the fact that they "cannot point to a single instance of anti-American flag burning in the last 30 years," the New York Times notes. "The video images that the American Legion finds so offensive to veterans and other Americans are either of Vietnam-era vintage or from other countries." Sen. Bob Bennett (R-UT), who opposes the amendment, has argued, "I don't want to amend the Constitution to solve a non-problem. People are not burning the flag."

Ally McLesbian
I have much more on Rick Steves & McDermott, as I took notes as well as photographed. I could write a story probably.

Rick Steves now opens up his headquarters for phone banking at crucial times, is a huge donor, very politically active and outspoken, has written some wonderful US OpEds, is an ambassador for global citizenship and true spirit of what American could and should be when he travels. He also advocates medical marijuana and can back it up. He is absolutely a treasure to this community (country & world).

As for Congressman McDermott, I am so proud to live in his district. He's a former psychiatrist, has travelled to over 200 countries (mostly on fact-finding missions) and when they call him "Bagdad Jim" as if it is an insult, that is the most ridiculous thing in the world. If anyone supports the troops in this United States of America, it is Jim McDermott. He compiled more evidence on depleted uranium than anyone, and has been on this issue since the lst Gulf War. Add to that his work in Africa with AIDS. It is because of Jim McDermott, for one, that we didn't pack up & leave the country after 9/11. I know that on that day I Googled "emigrating to Canada" immediately, suspecting that we were headed toward police state & war.

I guess I'm writing my article already, but these two individuals are part of the reason I even have any hope for the world at all.

TOKYO, Japan (CNN) -- Japan, Australia and the United States have united in saying that any test-launching of an intercontinental missile by North Korea would result in serious and stern consequences.

A Bush administration official told The Associated Press that Pyongyang has completed fueling a missile with the range to reach the United States, increasing the chances a launch might occur soon.

U.S. officials told Reuters news agency it was difficult to remove fuel from a Taepodong-2 missile, making it appear likely that Pyongyang was serious about the launch.

The launch window was about a month, AP reported.

Since word of a possible test-firing emerged last week, nations around the world have expressed growing concern.

On Monday, Japan's Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi said his nation would respond sternly to a missile test by North Korea. (Watch how Japan is taking the lead in tough talk against North Korea -- 1:11)

Earlier, Australia's Foreign Minister Alexander Downer warned the North Korean ambassador that "serious consequences would follow such a firing."

"Such action would be highly provocative and would further isolate the DPRK (Democratic People's Republic of Korea)," Downer said in a statement issued early Monday.

more...
http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/06/19/nkorea.missile/index.html

Bush Won't Back Down On Iranian Nukes
President Says No Talks Until Tehran Suspends All Uranium Enrichment

June 19, 2006

(CBS/AP) President Bush said Monday the United States will not waver in demanding that Iran suspend all uranium enrichment-related activity before America would join international talks to resolve the nuclear standoff.

"Nuclear weapons in the hands of this regime would be a grave threat to people everywhere," Mr. Bush said on the eve of a trip to Europe.

more...
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/06/19/politics/main1727391.shtml

Mirror, mirror on the mall,
Who's the biggest threat of them all?

I have finally been able to hook up with the Ohio campaign and will be joining them some time in September. Anyone interested in joining me is welcome to contact me directly. This is a dream come true for me to hopefully be in the middle of what will for sure be a knock down drag out campaign to help turn Ohio around and take back America.

Posted by: Ira at June 19, 2006 01:07 PM

Ira,

North or South Ohio? You know I'll be there.

Go get 'em, Ira! We WILL take back America in November!

Here's a link to the video that 15 year old Ava created for the Yearlykos convention...

Wow...

http://www.yearlykos.org/node/493

And here's a link to an interview with her on CNN which recounts that she's getting death threats over some of the other videos that she's done.

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2006/06/19.html#a8776

and here's a link to Ava's blog, www.peacetakescourage.com ...
http://www.peacetakescourage.com/page-home.htm

hat-tip to Gina (Yearlykos organizer) for the info on Ava here...
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/6/19/142118/977

sparrow the person I spoke with this morning was in Amherst,but they are not sure yet where I would best be able to help. I am hoping that together we can drag others along here to Ohio to help, even though we will be sacrificing time away from our jobs and family. The way I see it that will be little sacrifice for us, for what will be at stake especially in Ohio for '06 and again in '08. Maybe you can start educating me with publications on Ohio politics before I make it up there. Its time for us to be spending less time blogging and more time planning as to exactly what we will be doing and where we will be this November. Blogging is great but as Paul Hackett is fond of saying we need more boots on the ground, and Pa and Ohio are sure to once again be where the eyes of the nation will be focused.

Posted by: dwahzon at June 19, 2006 02:53 PM

Dw:

Saw those videos at Yearly KOS. Incredibly dynamic. No wonder why she's a threat. The videos are very very effective.

Check out this one from Ava...

Be prepared to be confronted...

http://www.peacetakescourage.com/whatwillyoudo.html

3 U.S. soldiers charged with killing of Iraqis

Three members of the 101st Airborne Division have been charged in connection with the deaths of three detainees during an operation near in southern Salaheddin province, Iraq, on May 9, the U.S. military announced Monday. A military news release said the charges in the case include murder, attempted murder, conspiracy, communicating a threat, and obstructing justice.

DEVELOPING STORY

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/06/19/soldiers.charged/index.html

John Kerry and Russ Feingold to Offer Amendment with Deadline to Redeploy U.S. Combat Troops From Iraq

Tomorrow John Kerry, Russ Feingold and Barbara Boxer will offer an amendment to the Defense Authorization bill that sets a deadline of July 1, 2007, for U.S. troops to be redeployed out of Iraq, for purposes of strengthening U.S. national security and increasing the Iraqis’ ability to establish stability throughout their country.

Below is a joint statement from John Kerry and Russ Feingold:

“For three years, Congress has played political games while the war in Iraq has gone on unchecked and unending. With the administration’s failure to offer a coherent or effective strategy in Iraq, it is long past time for Congress to offer a plan to redeploy our troops so we can give Iraq its best chance at stability, and refocus on al Qaeda and the terrorist networks that threaten the security of all Americans.

“We must redeploy to succeed – and we will put this national security imperative to a test in the United States Senate this week. We need a deadline for the redeployment of U.S. forces in Iraq. A deadline gives Iraqis the best chance for stability and self-government, and most importantly, it allows us to begin refocusing on the true threats that face our country.

“Our amendment recognizes the need to keep an over-the-horizon military presence in the Middle East to fight al Qaeda and its affiliates and protect regional security interests. Only troops essential to finishing the job of training Iraqi forces, conducting targeted counter-terrorist operations and protecting U.S. facilities and personnel should remain inside Iraq. The president also must move immediately to work with the Iraqis to convene a summit of Iraq’s neighbors and the international community to forge a lasting political settlement to give all Iraqis a stake in the new Iraq.

“A strong national security policy begins with recognizing that our massive presence in Iraq weakens our security and gives Iraqi politicians a crutch to avoid creating stability in their country. As long as 130,000 U.S. troops remain in Iraq indefinitely, that country will remain what a series of mistakes have made it -- a crucible for the recruitment and development of terrorists determined to fight Americans and an obstacle to an Iraqi government capable of governing and securing its country. Our troops have done their job in Iraq. It is time to redeploy – to help increase stability in Iraq, and more importantly, to strengthen the national security of the United States.”

The goal of the Kerry-Feingold plan is to undermine the insurgency by simultaneously pursing a political settlement and the redeployment of American forces. Their plan calls requires:

The redeployment of U.S. combat troops out of Iraq by July 1, 2007.

Only U.S. troops essential to completing the mission of standing up Iraqi security forces, conducting targeted counter-terrorist operations and protecting U.S. personnel and facilities would remain. President Bush has repeatedly said that when Iraqis stand up, we will stand down. However, that has not been happening. So far, the Iraqis have trained 265,600 security forces – just 7,000 shy of the Bush administration’s stated goal of 272,566. Yet just a few weeks ago, the Pentagon announced that they are sending 3,500 additional U.S. troops from Kuwait to Iraq.

The United States to maintain an over-the-horizon military presence to prosecute the war on terror and protect regional security interests.

The President to work with the new Iraqi government to convene a summit that includes those leaders, the leaders of the governments of each country bordering Iraq, representatives of the Arab League, the Secretary General of the North Atlantic Treaty Organization, representatives of the European Union, and leaders of the governments of each permanent member of the United Nations Security Council, to reach a comprehensive political agreement for Iraq that addresses fundamental issues including federalism, oil revenues, the militias, security guarantees, reconstruction, economic assistance and border security.

The Secretary of Defense to report to Congress on how U.S. troops will be withdrawn from Iraq by July 1, 2007.

Speaking of another honorable young person .. (Michelle, that is)

Hello all -

I just wanted to let you guys know that I received the following e-mail today from a staff member in THK's Washington office:

>

Thank you all, once again, for your phenomenal assistance and support with this project! I am deeply grateful!

I still have the photos of the book that I need to e-mail to you guys!!! I haven't forgotten and will try to get this done ASAP!

Thanks again!

Hope you all are well! Stay in touch!

- Michelle

My site: www.StandUpBeCounted.com
.....because decisions are made by those who show up

Please sign the Guestbook! Thanks!

Posted by: DiAnne at June 19, 2006 11:21 AM

I've known of Rick Steves' activism for NORML, an organization dedicated to legalization of medical marijuana. I've also known of his views on how NOT to be an ugly American when traveling abroad.

But I didn't know that his HQ was being used for phone banking - that's so great of him!

If and when I get to the Seattle area next week, I may have to spare some time to visit his HQ in Edmonds. It's a bit out of the way, but it's marked up on my mapping software.

Posted by: Ira at June 19, 2006 01:07 PM

Good for you, Ira! Hope your efforts will be fruitful.

I won't be able to go to Ohio physically, but I will find some other way to help.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060619/ap_on_re_as/nkorea_missile_37
Rice warns N. Korea against missile test
WASHINGTON - Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice leveled a warning Monday that "it would be a very serious matter and indeed a provocative act" if North Korea tested a long-range ballistic missile. Rice's remarks came after Bush administration officials said North Korea has apparently finished loading fuel into a ballistic missile, the latest signs that the reclusive communist state will soon test a weapon that could reach the United States.
~~~~~
At U.N. headquarters in New York, U.S. Ambassador John Bolton said he was holding preliminary consultations with Security Council members on steps that might be taken if North Korea fires a missile, "because it would obviously be very serious."

"But we don't really know what the North Korean intentions are at this point, so I think we need to wait for the event," he said.
~~~~~
Contrast Rice's and Bolton's statements with:
North Korea says it needed nuclear weapons and a such potential delivery systems as a missile to counter what it claims are U.S. intentions to invade or topple the government. The United States has repeatedly denied any plans to invade.

William Fisher | Poodle Diplomacy
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/061906A.shtml
"Civilian ambassadors" have been recruited by Karen Hughes's Public Diplomacy shop at the State Department to carry the message to the world that, "The United States welcomes all religions and rewards immigrants who embrace its democratic values with opportunities and freedom beyond their dreams." "This is going to be one hell of a hard sell," writes William Fisher. "Think about it. The US is waging two wars on countries that have overwhelmingly Muslim majorities. And it has launched a 'global war on terror' (GWOT) that largely targets Muslims. I suspect it's going to take a lot more than 'changing the messengers' to persuade the world to take the president at his word."

Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Blanco says she will send the National Guard to patrol streets of New Orleans after five teens shot dead.

(But it's going better elsewhere...)

Cheney Reasserts That Iraqi Insurgency Entered Its ‘Last Throes’ In May 2005

In May 2005, Vice President Cheney declared that the insurgency in Iraq was in its “last throes” and predicted “[t]he level of activity that we see today from a military standpoint, I think, will clearly decline.” Since that time, violence in Iraq has continued unabated.

Today at the National Press Club, Cheney was asked if he still believed that May 2005 was when the insurgency entered its “last throes.” He said he still did.

Cheney tries to spin his previous comments as a prediction of political progress. Cheney now says he meant that May 2005 would be the beginning of a “series of events when the Iraqis increasingly took over responsibility for their own affairs.” Actually, Cheney predicted that violence in the country, from May 2005 on, “will clearly decline.”

Full transcript:

http://thinkprogress.org/2006/06/19/cheney-defends-last-throes-2/

Justices accept another abortion case
Court expected to rule on pair of challenges in the fall

By Bill Mears
CNN

Monday, June 19, 2006

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The Supreme Court has accepted a second case testing the constitutionality of a federal law banning a specific, controversial late-term abortion procedure critics call "partial birth" abortion.

The cases could provide a judicial sea change, with the key vote perhaps coming from the high court's newest member, Justice Samuel Alito. He replaced Sandra Day O'Connor, who was a key swing vote for a quarter century upholding the basic right to abortion.

The views of Alito, a more conservative jurist, could prove crucial in the new debate. The justices agreed to decide the contentious issue this fall.

The new appeal comes from the Bush administration, which lost after a lawsuit filed by the reproductive rights group Planned Parenthood. A federal appeals court based in San Francisco threw out the federal Partial-Birth Abortion Act of 2003 as unconstitutional because it did not provide a health exception to pregnant women facing a medical emergency.

A similar ruling from a federal appeals court based in St. Louis reached similar conclusions.

The outcome of these latest challenges could turn on the legal weight given past rulings on the "health exception."

more...
http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/06/19/scotus.abortion/index.html

Mary from Rhode Island was supposed to be seeing John Kerry today, I think. MBK will be seeing him very soon too. Hope for reports. Love to get it straight from the blogger's mouth.

Ally
I can fill you in on how to get to Rick Steves' in Edmonds (N of here) or anything else you're interestsed in.

Hey Oncall,

If you're around, here is a retort to cut and run from John Murtha, posted over at DU: "Stay and Pay"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x2686752

DW,

Thanks for posting Ava's links. I'm awed! And the cnn interview with her was quite something. I love the question "getting used" and her response to it. They were testing that frame like they did with Cindy Sheehan to say that Cindy was being used.

I don't think it worked though.

Amazing videos. The wwjd one totally exemplified what I wish my fundie inlaws would see, except they don't.

Heritage Institute Attempt at Hipness

Government officials and outside experts agree that Bush and his European counterparts now recognize that, despite their differences, they need each other. Sort of like the Rolling Stones, according to John Hulsman, a foreign-policy specialist at the Heritage Foundation, a conservative Washington research center.

"Think of Keith Richards when he says to (Mick) Jagger, `This thing is bigger than both of us.' That's where we are," Hulsman said. "The kids want to save the marriage even though the love is gone."

http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/politics/14855233.htm

Ironically, from same article:

Bush initially had planned to stop in Ukraine on his way back from Austria, but opted instead to visit Budapest, Hungary, where he'll mark the 50th anniversary of an unsuccessful revolt against communist rule that Soviet troops brutally crushed.

The Vienna stop will include a roundtable discussion of freedom and democracy with Austrian students and a performance by the Vienna Boys Choir.

U.S. officials had hoped to house the president in one of the city's best hotel rooms - a luxury suite at the five-star Imperial Hotel - but Bush lost it to a rock star. The Sun, a British newspaper, reported that Jagger claimed the $4,500-a-night room days before U.S. officials sought to reserve it for Bush.

--Didn't this happen to him before?!!

Dianne,

We have trillion dollar deficit. Why is our president using our non-existant money to pay 4500 per night? I think he should foot the bill himself while we the tax payers can dole out 100 for it.

Where's the sacrifice he's so anxious to make us accept?

Sparrow
That occurred to me (the $4500) - it's sick.

I feel so sorry for these people - they can't all be insurgents - they're under seige.

US Troops Press Ahead With Ramadi Operation
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/061906T.shtml
Helicopters flew over the Iraqi town of Ramadi and warplanes could be heard overhead as US troops hunted down insurgents in the rebel stronghold on Monday, a Reuters witness said. Shops were shuttered and most residents stayed home, fearing a US offensive on the scale of the one that inflicted heavy destruction and loss of life in nearby Falluja in 2004.

& these Saudi women, blogging anonymously - are they really so different than what the right would like for us here?!

Saudi Women Unveil Opinions Online
http://www.truthout.org/issues_06/061906WA.shtml
In this country where women are forced to completely cover themselves in public, are barred from driving, and need permission to travel abroad, it's small wonder many are embracing the freedom of anonymity on the Internet. As Internet usage continues to climb here, so do the numbers of women who have started blogs.

another sad story related to women ..

Gender-Based Violence Galvanized Warlords' Foes
http://www.truthout.org/issues_06/061906WB.shtml
An epidemic of sexual violence during 15 years of lawlessness in Somalia was among the factors that strengthened opposition to this city's notorious warlords. The Islamic militias who drove them out in months of recent fighting were embraced by Somalia's women as keepers of public order, as a force strong enough and pious enough to keep Mogadishu's daughters safe.

We borrow money from the Chinese and Saudis to buy weapons to use as a "big stick" ..

Bush Gives Iran An Ultimatum On Uranium

Rice Warns North Korea on Missile Test

Posted by: Carol at June 19, 2006 05:53 PM

Carol,

I definitely like it (who couldn't?). Says it all without getting too wordy.

Dwahzon,

Those sure are excellent videos. I have e-mailed the links to as many people as I reasonably can. Thanks.

Carol,

Here is a posting from that DU site as well:

The slogan is funny, but the proper response to "cut and run" is "You people screwed up. You know it. Everyone knows it."

Posted by: DiAnne at June 19, 2006 05:42 PM

Thanks again DiAnne. I will send you an email a few days before my departure.

PNAC N.V. (aka there's gotta be a Dick in there somewhere)

http://www.newamericancentury.org/statementofprinciples.htm

Posted by: oncall at June 19, 2006 09:19 PM

Either I'm becoming one of those really fringe lefties, or you and I both are!

I like that response.

"You screwed up now it takes us to fix your screw up".

oncall,

Check your email.

Excuse me...but isn't this a little premature brain washing?

http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/06/19/poll.presidential/index.html

Posted by: sparrow at June 19, 2006 10:08 PM

YES, it is premature brainwashing! Both the neoCons AND Lamestream Media keep shoving Hillary down our throats like they figure we are either forced to swallow the inevitability that THEY have picked the Dem presidentail candidate for '08, or we puke in revulsion (I can't think of anyone who likes her position on DumDum's wars in Iraq and Afghanistan) - and neoCons win by default.

Remember when the DKos bloggers met in LV? I saw the interview with a woman blogger (can't remember her name) and when she kept referring to "he" for Dem candidates for '08, the interviewer (think it was Stephanopolous?) jumped all over her about no references to "she" or "her" ... and the woman blogger very forthrightly said Dems don't support Hillary because she has not come out against the war.

Lamestream Media and neoCons have yet to hear that message, however, so they keep on shoving Hillary down our throats.... As usual, they are repeating and repeating and repeating their message like it's a done deal already. I resent their attitude.

NonnyO,

It's also not just anti-war or online activists who don't support her.

They don't support her because he last name is related to someone they blame for this mess.

They don't like her because they see her as pushy and maybe as a little too 'wishy washy' nowadays.

These are the masses.

People want to have a woman candidate, but Hilary doesn't have enough support anymore.

Posted by: sparrow at June 19, 2006 10:08 PM

Yes, it is a bit premature, but I must live in a bubble. I am really quite surprised that Kerry's numbers equaled Clinton's in terms of people whom they "definitely would not vote for". I get press statements from JK nearly everyday in my e-mail, and if most of those respondents read what I am reading, I think they would feel differently.

I believe the 2008 nominations may come down to a Democrat and a Republican that most in the US have not even heard of before. I think that is as likely as anyone being speculated about now.

People want to have a woman candidate, but Hilary doesn't have enough support anymore.
Posted by: sparrow at June 19, 2006 10:45 PM

Agreed.

I'd love to see a viable woman candidate run for office - but one who hasn't adopted things like the neoCon pro-war, anti-life, anti-choice stance so prevalent by rightwingnuts. I wouldn't even want her to be moderate in her positions - no one can please everyone all the time, no matter what, and I detest middle-of-the-road wishy-washy rhetoric trying to please everyone on all sides.

However, I am also realistic, and don't expect the US will ever elect a woman president in my lifetime. This nation is still too influenced by the status quo patriarchal culture to ever accept a woman as leader - she'd be crucified in the media. Oddly enough, I know other countries wouldn't bat an eyelash about a woman leading this country because many other countries (just as no one in any other country batted an eyelash about Clinton's indiscretion), even patriarchal countries, have had women as leaders. In past centuries when monarchs had any say-so, England prospered under their queens (while many kings ran a deficit, with queens there was a surplus). It's only the good-ol'-boy's-club patriarchal attitudes in this country that would make a woman president's terms absolute torture for her and her supporters - she would be damned if she did and damned if she didn't, regardless of any issues.

I just resent the continual nonsense where Lamestream Media and the neoCons keep shoving Hillary down our throats when she so obviously has no support from Democrats....

Despite many of us getting emails, people do not know what Kerry is doing, and don't care. Many don't care what any good things the other electeds are doing and just want to complain.

The polls may reflect just wanting new, like a new prom king.

Also may reflect that they will never forgive him for giving us BushCo for four more, regardless of his having exceeded goals, 7 million more popular vote, really won the swing states, having to straddle the fear campaign and change of presidents during war. Not to mention all that misinformation and fraud. Just one chance.

I was reminded recently how Bush won the moron vote, and the lack of Dem organizations around the country lost it for us, aided by all that election fraud in many guises.

Sorry, but either CNN throws marbles in the air and counts them, ignores data all togther, or this poll is proof positive the public does not know the extent of the harm done by this conservative philosophy so embodied by McCain.

And Rudy? They haven't seen Guiliani Time and heard about his downside. Could we really be voting on another throwback to 911?

Posted by: Marjorie G at June 20, 2006 12:15 AM

Right on. I don't think the people of this country give a good (or bad) rats ass about factual information, wouldn't know how to find it even if they wanted to.

The REAL addiction this country needs to wean itself from is television. Capitalism at it's finest, resulting in base human nature at it's worst.

Let's get remedial, shall we? You have mind control (i.e. those being controlled don't even know it, hence the term) and you have those who pay (lets call them sponsors to sound positive) for the information being sent to your mind as effortlessly as selling you a hot, fluffy blueberry muffin (which was baked in a factory, freeze dried, then nuked by some 17 yr old headbanger).

Now, those who "sponsor" the information would NEVER have a political agenda, right???

It's when I stopped watching the idiot box cold turkey that mine eyes have seen the gory.

U.S.A. INC.
"In The Red"