Lincoln Chafee: 'Holding to the Center, Losing My Seat'

He's one of the few Republicans I can stand - sometimes Arlen Specter, sometimes Olympia Snowe or a couple other of the Northeastern moderate Republicans. I hope he joins with the Independents and votes his conscience in whatever capacity he ends up in the for the future.. He stood up against Bolton - wasn't he the guy who was almost in tears thinking of his grandchildren living in a world where a hothead like that was at the UN representing us? So was I. I appreciate that.

I never liked Lieberman running with Gore - i thought it was an opportunistic way to try to get more Jewish vote in Florida which I don't think worked. Better he's an Independent than a Republican and hope he at least votes with the Democrats. Far be it from me to publicly trash a Democrat - you won't catch me doing it very often, even if I'm pissed. It's a big tent and it just got bigger. Glad we have Bernie Sanders in the Senate instead of Congress and as an Independent in the old seat of Jeffers (who switched from Republican if I remember right) he will vote with the Dems but he's actually (gasp) a Socialist. I'm down with Independents to the left and slight right of center as long as they do what's right and a real big tent can accomodate the spectrum from socialist to slightly right of center. Since we only have one and now maybe two viable parties we have no choice but to be broad-based. We're not like the Europeans or even the Canadians with a coalition government so we must be a humongous tent. Chafee voted against alot of Bush's nefarious budget schemes.

From the Washington Note

September 7, 2006
The Honorable Condoleezza Rice
Secretary of State
US Department of State
Washington, DC 20520

Dear Secretary Rice:

I write to you with regard to the nomination of John Bolton to be US Representative to the United Nations. Today, the Senate Committee on Foreign Relations was scheduled to have a vote on Mr. Bolton's nomination. The decision on whether to hold that vote is in the Chairman of the Committee's hands. Chairman Lugar decided to hold the vote over to a later date, and I support that decision.

It is no secret that I have serious questions about this Administration's policies in the Middle East. As we tackle enormous problems in the region, most notably with Iran and Iraq, I believe we need to be successful in forging alliances. A critical part of that work is accomplished by our Ambassador to the UN.

One of the key issues with many of our allies is the situation with the Palestinians. I support the creation of a viable, contiguous Palestinian state living side-by-side in peace with its neighbor Israel. I believe progress on this front would be beneficial for the Palestinians, and futher America's, and Israel's security. The President, and you, frequently have spoken in favor of establishing a Palestinian state. On February 26, 2003, President Bush said "Success in Iraq could also begin a new state for Middle Eastern peace, and set in motion progress towards a truly democratic state." On February 22, 2005, the President said "Israel must freeze settlement activity." And on April 14, 2004, the President wrote to then-Prime Minister Sharon, "The United States supports the establishment of a Palestinian state this is viable, contiguous, sovereign, and independent, so that the Palestinian people can build their own future in accordance with the vision I set forth in June 2002 and with the path set forth in the roadmap."
Phase one of that Road Map states clearly that Israel will freeze all settlement activity. Yet, just this week, it is reported that 690 homes will be built in the West Bank settlements of Maale Adumim and Betar Illit. While the official US policy hs been against settlement activity, no credible observer could think that the US could not do more to stop these new actions.

While I am a strong supporter of Israel, and believer her security is non-negotiable, we should have a more balanced approach -- so that both sides can see that we are an honest broker for peace. I have been a long-time critic of the disparity between the rhetoric and the actions of the Administration on the subject of the Israeli-Palestinian peace process. However, now I fear that even the rhetoric is going to stop. Is this expansion of settlement activity a signal that holding both sides to their commitments under the Road Map is no longer official US policy?

It is my hope that answers will be forthcoming about our policy toward the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, and the Committee can reconvene to debate Ambassador Bolton's confirmation.

Sincerely,

Lincoln Chafee

Look. That is a much stronger and more logical approach and with more conscience than many of the Democrats have had the spine to present. I have never to my knowledge voted for a Republican because I believe that someone with convictions like his should leave the party out of principle, so if he does, cool. I think I am going to send him a letter.

This is on MichiganLiberal.com

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seems like an intriguing approach to me,
Otter

Are we really expected to fall in line behind Murtha when he is one of the most paid off members of congress there is?

As a matter of a fact, isn't those perks the reason he did not speak out sooner than 5 years later...?

Yes, yes, I do believe that would be the exact same Murtha.

So much for setting standards of 'ethics'.

The weekend before the election I spoke with the Whiehouse campaign and had them fax my office voter lists to call into Rhode Island and implored, actually annoyed many of you here to join me. Many of the voters I spoke with on Monday night were telling me they were still undecided, and my message was that this time we needed a Deocratic Senate and unfortunately could not do that with Senator Chaffee in office. Personally this was one of the most difficult campaigns to have worked on, to defeat Senator Chaffee and it was truly regrettable that Senator Chaffee had not seen the writing on the wall earlier. However I am unwilling to sacrifice Senator Jack Reed in a future election for even a Democratic Senator Chaffee. Perhaps he could play the role of Defense Secy like Sen Cohen did for Clinton in a future Democratic Whitehouse.

I just took the time to read back over the threads from the weekend. Due to circumstances beyond my control, I was AWOL all weekend.

On Saturday afternoon, however, I drove up to Philadelphia with my son. We got there in time to listen to the blogger's discussion of impeachment that democrats.com sponsored.

I didn't have the camera or the notebook, so my impressions are two days old. I also missed the introductions, so I only knew who a few of the eight bloggers were:

Dave Lindorff, Liza Sabater/Culture Kitchen, Rob Kall/OpEd News, Martin from Booman Tribune, Chris from Afronetizen, and others I did not recognize by name or blog.

They all agreed that the Bush Administration were a bunch of nasty criminals and consequences needed to be applied, but they also covered the range of possibilities that the DCPers here have.

Rob Kall represented the go-for-impeachment, but make it about investigating end of the spectrum. Dave Lindorff made the compelling case for putting impeachment high on the list and sooner rather than later. Many mentioned that it is essential to go for impeachment in order to show the world we get it.

What is clear that the netroots do not have consensus and therefore the pressure that would need to be brought to bear is going to be sporadic and labile. What we do have consensus on is investigating and that was clear from reading these threads and hearing from everyone at the event.

If we can all gather in the name of accountability, investigation, and consequences, we will get where we need to get to, without naming it as a particular and perhaps-unattainable destination.

The end of the story has not been written yet. Let's keep on and we will get to help write it.

Oh--forgot. If you want to sign the petition for impeachmen, here it is:

http://democrats.com/peoplesemailnetwork/88

For those who want to diss Murtha, who didn't know he used to be a warhawk and who ever said he was progressive? The fact that he wasn't and spoke up were supposed to enhance his credibility. It would be similarly easy to stomp on people like Rand Beers, one of the first to leave 43's administration, or any of the dissident generals, or people like Richard Clarke who whistleblew after working for 4 administrations.

It's only possible to have a velvet revolution when some of the dissent comes from within the ranks. We have Brent Scowcroft critical of 43 and now influencing him via 41 (indirectly, like Baker). Both Baker and Gates have checkered histories and I wouldn't trust any CIA in a dark alley but they're what we have.

Speaking out against the war is speaking out against the war.
I am not going to be one to trash a Democrat even publicly. Lieberman isn't a Democrat any more but I've got bigger fish to fry than him. In my state we have Patty Murray, always on our side, yet she also brings home the pork to Boeing. That's politics and that's life.

I will back John Murtha for sticking his neck out. As Kos said when I mentioned Kerry writing there, "Better late than never."

I am not for impeachment. I was for impeachment in 2002. I am for Hague tribunal, for a bunch of them.

The lame ducks are heading back to Congress. Bush is looking to change the course, under pressure. McCain is positioning himself as the warhawk candidate for 2008. Democrats are pressuring for dialogue with Iran, Syria, Turkey and Ohmert says Israel has no plans to attack Iran.

Every morning lately I have to get up and pinch myself. I am seeing the glass more as half full than half empty.

Control of congress was always going to be part of the incremental cycling back toward the right wing losing control.
I worked with a person who used to be with Radical Women and Freedom Socialist Party and worked tirelessly for 3 decades against the religious right, as she is a lesbian but also because she has a free-thinking brain. She then worked for Gore, which I was not prescient enough to do at the time (this was when he was a centrist and his environmental views had been framed by Rove as "environmental wacko" stuff). We worked together for Kerry, and she was a fellow early adopter for Kerry in a sea of Deaniacs (of which we had the largest concentration outside Vermont, and for which we were the only state where they would not concede to Kerry at the national convention). We made a pact that we would support the aforementioned "incremental steps" upward if it took the rest of our lives. We are a short attention, immediate gratification generation. Impeachment will only work if the whole tent forms a mob to do it. We need to take advantage of what's already being given to us, what's on the table. I would much rather see people like Henry Waxman lay out their evidence first. We need to keep media distraction off the lame ducks and on the positive things the Democrats can accomplish before they are even inaugurated into their new positions. We need to keep the lame ducks as lame as possible to they won't pass wiretapping bill etc. If the people have spoken and are for minimum wage increase and against the war, then we need them to know that the likes of McCain are against minimum wage increase and for the war. Now is the perfect time to expose the drug companies.

Channel your anger positively and it will have stronger results.

Keep Your Eye On the Right

Recent headlines at NewsMax:

Lieberman: Call Me a Democrat
Gingrich Sees Hope for Conservative Agenda
Rupert Murdoch Has No Iraq Regrets
Mississippi Rep. Rips Rangel's Smear
Israeli Official: Strike On Iran Possible
One-Third of World: Bad Toilets
Students Ban Pledge of Allegiance
Sen. Lincoln Chafee May Leave GOP
Mexico City Approves Gay Civil Unions
Belly Fat Causes Inflammation, Arthritis.
The DHEA Test — Every Man Needs to Take It.

I agree with Dianne and believe that pushing for impeachment will be counterproductive and make Progressives look like Newt's team out to get Clinton, especially considering that the '08 Presidential campaign will be starting soon. Sorry others don't concur.

Huffington on Murtha

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/arianna-huffington/jack-murtha-for-majority-_b_33942.html

Talking Points Memo

The history of the 110th Congress is unlikely to rise and fall on whether John Murtha or Steny Hoyer (D-MD) becomes the new majority leader -- a change from the 109th Congress, which was inextricably linked to the fortunes of then-Majority Leader Tom Delay. But that was in part the result of having a figurehead Speaker in Dennis Hastert. Pelosi is no one's proxy and appears poised to reconsolidate the historical and constitutional powers of the Speaker of the House--an effort which may be blunted if Hoyer prevails despite Pelosi's opposition to his candidacy.

Hamas and Fatah agree on a unity government. Ohmert agrees that the US should have dialogue with Iran. Hell is freezing over. This is what happens when the neocons are no longer running the show. More foreign students are even coming back to study in the United States!

DiAnne,

For the record, I have not dissed Jack Murtha for being a lifelong hawk who turned dovish on Iraq. As you noted, it was his known history as an emphatic non-peacemonger that gave his words such weight when he began speaking out against our failed wars of conquest. This was especially significant when those who thought we should get out of Iraq sooner rather than later were being broadly painted as left-wing moonbats who had no clue about what wars are for.

On the other paw, I have clearly expressed my distaste for Mr. Murtha's back-room deal making and its harmful effects on Democratic legislative agendas, most recently at the end of the last thread. I am not going to apologize for taking that position, nor am I going to mediate it in the name of some half-baked principle of not taking Democrats to task just because they're, well, Democrats.

Jack Murtha is a consummate old-school politician, swapping votes for power and pork-barrel payouts in the best time-honored tradition of smoke-filled rooms where the real business of government is meted out quid by quo. He has often skated on thin ice over the years, ethics-wise -- in fact, during the ABSCAM corruption investigations, the ice beneath his feet was very thin indeed.

That's just the way it is. Murtha is a very powerful man in Congress, albeit one who was relatively unknown to most outside the Beltway until he spoke out publicly against the Iraq war. I don't begrudge him that power, either; because I'm jaded enough to recognize that's how government really works behind all the press conferences and pretty red & blue balloons, and I'm cynical enough to be glad that it's one of our guys who's got that much juice to work with right now.

However, since I do believe that Mr. Murtha has put personal power and political gain before partisan party progress on more than one occasion -- on more than a few (or even quite a few) occasions, in fact -- you can expect me to be keep a close eye on his actions in the coming months as he consolidates his power-broker status in the House.

And if he abuses the people's trust and/or works against the party's progressive agenda for his own political purposes, you can bet your deep blue donkey that I'll be right here calling him out for it as many times as are necessary... Big-D Democrat or no Big-D Democrat.

(Oh, and here's a quite recent link to peruse by way of an FYI on the subject at hand: http://tinyurl.com/yblcdm )

capital letters in your title are no guarantee of immunity on planet otter,
Otter

Posted by: Bubba at November 13, 2006 10:45 AM

Count me in with Bubba and DiAnne. Holding feet to the fire re: investigations is something I'm happy to do and support.

And although I posted a link the other day, I haven't seen much discussion anywhere on the criminal investigation against Rummy, Gonzolas and Tenet in Germany. That will be something I'd like to watch and support.

Re: Murtha, again, I agree with DiAnne. No one person will satisfy all areas of disagreement at any one time. Now is the time to deal with Iraq and I'll give Pelosi the benefit of the doubt that Murtha is the one she wants as House Majority Leader to do just that. I'm not going to lose trust and faith at this point... Color me optimistic. I really, truly didn't think we'd be where we are today. We caught the wave, I'm willing to ride it.

It's a brand new world. We have a chance to participate. Part of that participation (for me) will involve trust. As Tug McGraw used to say, "Ya Gotta Believe." Well, I believe we're going to do the right things, both our elected reps and our citizen patriots. ;-)

London Yank at Kos always thinks Iran is going to be attacked.
I hope that it isn't! He makes some good points, though a little given to hyperbole.
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2006/11/13/73625/672

Just read Olmert from Newsweek, on Iran and maybe he would like to attack but will be pressured to allow talks first. He makes the point that Ahmadinejad has to fear something http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2006/11/13/73625/672

Well my mouth dropped open the other day when I heard Ted Koppel interviewed on NPR and he said the thing Iran feared was Saddam Hussein & now he's gone. That's a good point and no one else had the nerve to say it.

Posted by: Bubba at November 13, 2006 10:45 AM

I understand your reluctance, Bubba, but like it or not, Newt's team did a number on the Democratic party, the nation, and the world.

I think to let them get away with what they have done and were about to try to do, is a deadly mistake, because a message needs to be sent loud and clear to the Neocon's, our nation's people, and the world. It must be handled professionally, and with class.

Putting on my tin foil hat for two seconds, I really wonder how much of a change in our policy towards Iraq there is going to be. I also wonder why Rove is being so docile.

Could it be because of Fitzgerald's investigation?

Dubya looked like he was running scared a short while back when he admitted to torture.

Why are they docile all of a sudden? Is a big shoe about to drop?

Cracks me up, remembering how Dubya was campaigning for all those guys last month, talking tough and winking at people. What bubble was he in?

Comes the dawn. Of a new day. With power comes responsibility. I pray we use it wisely.

If I had more time, I'd probably make more sense. The thing is, after last Tuesday and Wednesday, I trust the collective. For a long time I didn't, only trust individuals and their actions. I was disgusted with the collective. Thankfully, for the collective they came up to my standards. ;-b (Yes, I'm that arrogant and pissy.) A majority now, even including Poppy's men, who I won't trust in this lifetime, are pulling in the same direction. I'm grateful and thankful for this majority pull and for now, am going to go along with the flow and trust that together, we will make the right decisions.

And that's about all I have to say about the overview of "what's next." :-)

Keep these photos in case McCain runs:

http://www.upper-left.blogspot.com/

hat tip to Mark Barrett

Truth Shall Prevail

I do hope something happens with the cases under Fitzgerald.
I am also glad the Boehner vs McDermott got appealed on Halloween. I want to know what Henry Waxman has.

KJ

I agree about the collective - this is one of those times where it can be useful. Herds can take on any sort of mentality.

Otter
Thanks for the clarification. Thinking Ted Stevens. Pelosi wasn't born yesterday. Let's hope her judgment is good. What do you know about the other guy Hoyer? It's all going to be interesting.

Nope. Nancy Pelosi for damn sure wasn't born yesterday. She *is* Tommy D'Alessandro's daughter, after all. People who forget that do so at their own political peril.

Oh, and as for Steny Hoyer, I don't really know much about him beyond what anyone can find out pretty easily using The Google and the Wikipedias.

I do know that Hoyer has actively opposed Nancy Pelosi at the back-room level for several years; that Fox News thinks he should be the next House majority leader; and that, hailing from Maryland as he does, Hoyer of all people should understand what's involved in facing off against Tommy D'Alessandro's daughter, ahem ahem.

And as for trusting Speaker Pelosi's judgment, well... let's just note that if I'd've only lived a few miles farther north than I did, I'd've voted for her every time.

go nancy go,
Otter

How embarrassing for Dubya, to have to have Daddy bail him out again.

P. S. -- Shrub is *still* a doink.

truth said "because a message needs to be sent loud and clear to the Neocon's" we need to push impeachment.

That message was sent last tuesday. Had the message last tuesday been vote dems we want to impeach the president, we would not be in control today. This is my belief, but voters on tuesday voted for a change in Iraq, in stem cell research and in economic policies that favor the wealthy. We have spent 14 years in the wilderness. This is our chance to prove that we are not the polar opposite of the neocons, that we as Progressives believe in the collective good of this country and will fight for our democracy and policies that help the common good. If we are seen as only the polar opposite of the neocons, we will be finished in '08 and it will another generation before Dems will be given the opportunity to govern. Bush's impeachment will come in January '09 when a Progressive is sworn in as commander in chief. Bush will be viewed as a very small inconsequential footnote in history remembered for Katrina, a disatsrous war and bungling. We have 2 years to elect a Progressive President, that is where my energy and hopefully the Democratic's Party's energy will be directed.

Posted by: Bubba at November 13, 2006 12:18 PM

Bubba, I don't care if it comes to impeachment. I just believe in checks and balances. A censure would be fine with me, if that's the furthest we could go, but to let it go without any kind of accountability or justice is inviting others to do the same as the Bush cabal has done. That is my concern.

You could be perfectly and absolutely correct, Bubba. I don't know if I am right, but it's the way I see it.

Otter
I was reading yesterday's Seattle P I and looks like when Gephart left, Hoyer opposed Pelosi for House Minority leader and she beat him. Ah politics - it's like running for cheerleader in middle school.

Ohlmert is ready for a prisoner swap? Someone has clout!
It's like Bush I is running the country now instead of Bush II!

The people who assassinated Lebanon's prime minister a few years ago are coming to trial and the government is going along with the UN? Tony Blair is wanting to open up dialogue with Syria and Lebanon? What the heck is going on behind the scenes? It seems like the Democrats didn't just win dominance over the Legislative branch but there must have been a quiet coup within the Republican ranks! Cheney seems to have been overthrown somehow!

John Howard of Australia wants dialogue with Syria and Iran?
Al-Maliki is meeting with General Abizaid and there is pressure to work with neighbors? Let's hope this works and isn't just a prelude to war with Iran after saying all diplomatic options have been exhausted. Bush still has veto power. Is Bush meeting with the Iraq group yet? We were supposed to bbe able to hear something 2 PM Eastern.

http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/CrisesArticle.aspx?storyId=N13268090&WTmodLoc=World-R5-Alertnet-5

Oh man he did meet with the Iraq study group. They didn't lay out alternatives yet and they meet with Dems and Blair tomorrow. Bush doesn't really want to work with Iran and Syria but may be pressured to do so. He is such a jerk.

Bush is going to give a major foreign policy speech and Al-Maliki is going to sack a bunch of "under-performing ministers' - man oh man

On Impeachment: I think we have more cause to impeach Bush than anything anyone dreamed up during the Clinton impeachment! Having said that do I believe we should do it, this is where is comes down to whats right for the country over any personal feelings I may have on the issue. No I do not think it should be the absolute goal of the new house to do this. There will be hearings if things go the way I believe they will during this process the house may have no choice, and that is fine, but should it be the goal I do not believe so. I want to see how things play out. I and many others are however demanding the oversight that we the American People are entitled to by our elected officials. If the Democrats do not do this if they fail to give us the oversight they do so at their own peril.

They need to nip Bush and Companies kingly leanings in the bud fast, it needs to be one of the top priorities in Jan. I am counting on them but still skeptical that they will do it.

KJ is backed by economist Paul Krugman:

True to form, some reporters still seem to be falling for the conservative spin. "If it walks, talks like a conservative, can it be a Dem?" asked the headline on a CNN.com story featuring a photo of Senator-elect Jon Tester of Montana. In other words, if a Democrat doesn't fit the right-wing caricature of a liberal, he must be a conservative.

But as Robin Toner and Kate Zernike of The New York Times pointed out yesterday, what actually characterizes the new wave of Democrats is a "strong streak of economic populism."

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/111306P.shtml

We need to back Henry Waxman - he is an investigative sort of fellow, like Elliot Spitzer.

As a lame duck with control of Congress still, Bush will try to keep Bolton in, which hopefully won't work. He'll go to Vietnam next week, to try to get a free trade agreement going with them. That might work. Nothing will be decided about Iraq before he goes because the Iraq group won't present their alternatives til next week. Who knows why. He'll probably try to get a guest worker program going, which Dems will be more likely to support than his own party. Other than that, he'll eat turkey and open presents and then in January he'll be an even lamer duck.

"It's like Bush I is running the country now instead of Bush II!..."
"Cheney seems to have been overthrown somehow!"

DiAnne, rode up to KC last Friday with my friend the Prof and his wife. I said I thought Poppy must have orchestrated a coup. Prof's wife thought maybe it was a family intervention. Same thing.
Thanks for the reuters link, off to read. Looking forward to the Iraq Study Group's recommends.

Henry Waxman, go Henry. We'll get the neoconartists, it just may take longer than some of us would like and it may even take a different form (international v national).

FYI, I was so excited about the Missouri Constitution amendment in support of stem cell research, but scuttlebut has it what really put Claire over the top was her support (and the passage) of a state minimum wage increase. Populist economics. People need to get back on their feet.

Oh and Nan was wondering about Cheney's power, if he still had it, or it had been stripped. Sounds like he is a lame duck hunter. b:-)

Yall think I was coming down on Murtha because he is a hawk..?

I am also a liberal hawk, the breed is not as rare as people think.

My problem with Murtha was not even that he waited so long to speak out, although I must say I am seriously disappointed it did take him so long.

No, my problem with Murtha is he has long been one of the top recipients of lobbiest money from the military intrests. They have paid him long and well to influence legislation on their behalf. It is not a secret nor does it happen in a vaccuum.

In other words, he has grown fat as a pig from the very war it took him so long to speak out against. He is in essence a war profiteer.

And any of us are supposed to somehow be comfortable with this man leading up an 'investigation' of georgies wrong doing...? The same wrong doing that brought a hell of a lot of money Murthas way...? I don't think so.

It is a perfectly fair question to ask did Murtha speak out because someone got behind on a payment...? For a few dollars more will he stfu again?

I know he is not the only one. Lets say Fienstien, her husband put how much money in their personal accounts after all his Iraq contracts went through so smoothly...?

I am not inclined to feel pity for any dem who voted for this war, and helped themselves to tax payer money stained by the blood of our finest sons. They have been accomplices all along.

The more I think of Pelosi putting up Murtha, the more it smacks of a whitewash to me.

I have been told I am too rigid, I believe too intensly, but I am getting really sick of subjugating my own ethics for people I know are lying, being bought off, or are just downright cowardly.

I like Pelosi, but Murtha is a serious problem.

And no, it is not because he is a hawk.

There is a big difference between a hawk and a vulture.

... to let it go without any kind of accountability or justice is inviting others to do the same as the Bush cabal has done. That is my concern.
Posted by: Truth Shall Prevail at November 13, 2006 12:32 PM

That is my concern, also, when I hear that 'impeachment is off the table.'

Dumbya has gotten away with murder - literally and figuratively - all his life, and thousands of people are dead because of the lies we've been told, because of the unconstitutional and illegal wars spawned, and the infringement on our rights and our privacy is unconscionable. He's never been held accountable for anything his entire misbegotten life. (You can imagine how badly I wish his mother had miscarried the pregnancy that spawned him!)

If Bu$h and his minions are let go with a slap on the fingers (which is about all the 'power' a Senate censure has), then it's an open invitation to continue the unconstitutional and illegal war in Iraq, and for future abuses of the executive branch (an added reason MCA '06 must be repealed, since it gives him - or any future president - dictatorial powers). And we do all realize that if a Dem had done what Bu$hCo has done, they'd have been brought up on impeachment charges long before this in a heartbeat, yes? Compromising has brought nothing but doing things Bu$h's way - always, every single time. That's only led to the disastrous predicament we're in right now.

Whether Bu$h-Cheney, or any future pres-VP combo, we do NOT need dictators for leaders. We need to restore the balance of powers given to us by the Founding Fathers in the Constitution (bloody brilliant document - and all of it was written in elementary English - nothing in high falutin' legalese so prevalent in the kind of legislation our Congress Critters so love to pass without even reading the contents!).

If we can't impeach, we have no way to punish the errant spoiled little brat who has been rescued again by his daddy, just as he has done all of Junior's life (Gates certainly seems to be just a more mild-mannered version of Rummy, and the Iraq commission with Baker et al. - Poppy's buddies left over from the Iran-Contra days, just as Gates is - will somehow whitewash the whole Iraq mess and just prolong the agony, which will result in more deaths, more destruction for which we will have to pay reparations).

If our Congress Critters refuse to do what's right by the American people and impeach the criminals, refuse to repeal the MCA '06 with it's dictatorial powers, refuse to repeal other crappy legislation that helps Bu$hCo abuse the powers of the executive branch, and refuse to seek justice on the part of the dead who have died in vain for lies and oil, then I hope the World Court takes the matter out of our hands and tries the entire Bu$h cabal for war crimes (and we do know that the illegal invasion of Iraq was a war crime, just as torture and the concentration camps are a war crime under the Geneva Conventions).

Slapping the fingers of the spoiled brat who has thrown temper tantrums and called people names for six years, all while hoping that giving in to him just one more time will make him go away and be quiet for a change and stop embarrassing us is NOT a strategy that works; it just makes him throw more temper tantrums. After six miserable years and thousands of lives lost for lies and oil, I would have thought the Congress Critters would have figured that one out. Doing something over and over and hoping for a different result is the definition of insanity, and our Congress Critters have amply demonstrated that fact.

Seems to me we have two choices: keep giving in to the spoiled brat (which will only allow further bad behavior in the future once he realizes he isn't going to be stopped by a Dem majority in Congress), or punish him for his crimes (and make darn good and sure he can't do those things again). There is no middle ground here (Congress has tried that for six years), because any middle ground will still result in letting him continue his crime spree with the implied "approval" of the American people via our elected representatives and senators, even if the vast majority of Americans (and the rest of the world) are horrified by what we know about already - and I'm sure we'll find out they've done worse things than we know about.

Obviously, I'm not in a conciliatory mood. Come January 4, the day after they're sworn into office, I want the Congress Critters to DO something about the spoiled brat in charge, and DO something about the little gang of bullies who encourage him.... Censure, investigate the known and unknown crimes of the administration, yes... but DO SOMETHING!!! (I'd prefer immediate impeachment, but in lieu of that, let the World Court arrest those criminals in charge and try them for war crimes, even if they are still in office, since Congress has, so far, refused to do anything to stop the criminal cabal, and if they take impeachment off the table, they will continue to do absolutely nothing to stop him and his gang of bullies.)

I'm tired of feeling like Harry Potter hanging upside down in the troll's hand....

BTW Karen,

That was a very interesting post on the impeachment bloggers, for lack of a better word.

I think if we are not able to call georgie for his crimes then we do not deserve the freedoms he took from us.

The faster we impeach him, the faster we can reclaim our dignity. I am sick of the entire world looking at us like we are all the monster he is.

Impeachment is the only option we have short of The Pitchfork Revolution.

Hey, it worked for France.

Murtha - On the Issues

Rated 0% by NARAL, indicating a pro-life voting record
Rated 50% by the ACLU, indicating a mixed civil rights voting record.
Rated 43% by the US COC, indicating a mixed business voting record.
Rated 22% by CURE, indicating anti-rehabilitation crime votes.
Rated 91% by the NEA, indicating pro-public education votes. Rated 45% by the LCV, indicating a mixed record on environment.
Rated 53% by the Christian Coalition: mixed voting record on families.
Rated 40% by CATO, indicating a mixed record on trade issues. (Dec 2002)
Rated A+ by the NRA, indicating a pro-gun rights voting record.
Rated 89% by APHA, indicating a pro-public health record.
Rated 44% by SANE, indicating a mixed record on military issues.
John Murtha on Immigration
Rated 0% by FAIR, indicating a voting record loosening immigration.
Rated 100% by the AFL-CIO, indicating a pro-union voting record
Rated 100% by the ARA, indicating a pro-senior voting record. (
Rated 26% by NTU, indicating a "Big Spender" on tax votes

If the Hague is good enough for Milosovich it's good enough for W

Steny Hoyer supporters

BARNEY FRANK

JOHN DINGELL

JOHN LEWIS

HENRY WAXMAN

LUCILLE ROYBAL-ALLARD

ELLEN TAUSCHER

JAMES OBERSTAR

IKE SKELTON

I'm with Dianne 100%.

To the Hague!

The Brits may just offer up a sacrificial poodle and join us there.

What a party, count me in.

Rated 100% by NARAL, indicating a pro-choice voting record. Rated 87% by the ACLU, indicating a pro-civil rights voting record
Rated 46% by COC, indicating a mixed business record
Rated 56% by CURE, indicating mixed votes on rehabilitation. Rated 85% by the LCV, indicating pro-environment votes
Rated 15% by the Christian Coalition: an anti-family voting record.
Rated 22% by CATO, indicating a pro-fair trade voting record. Rated F by the NRA, indicating a pro-gun control voting record.
Rated 100% by APHA, indicating a pro-public health record
Rated 100% by SANE, indicating a pro-peace voting record
Rated 0% by FAIR, indicating a voting record loosening immigration
Rated 87% by the AFL-CIO, indicating a pro-union voting record. Rated 100% by the ARA, indicating a pro-senior voting record. Rated 22% by NTU, indicating a "Big Spender" on tax votes

He's cool - don't know why Fox favors him, don't know what's Pelosi's strategy w/Murtha

Now don't have a strong opinion - more research needed

I think Pelosi is taking a risk with the pro-gun anti-choice conservative Democrat in order to draw in centrists and progressives - he's antiwar now after all. If she fails, it will be a faux pas. It's a secret vote. The black and Hispanic caucusses seem to be supporting Hoyer. Pelosi was a Senate page with Hoyer.

The Nation says Murtha is on the corrupt list

http://www.thenation.com/blogs/capitalgames?bid=3&pid=140129

This country floors me.

This country floors me.

Posted by: DiAnne at November 13, 2006 04:06 PM

Since when?

Carpet Diem

Pelosi's alliance with Murtha is based on one simple, very basic fact of political life:

Power. You either gots it or you doesn't.

Pelosi understands machine politics because she was born into it. Murtha understands machine politics because he's lived it.

Both of them know full well that power consolidated is power magnified. They want to make sure that sufficient power is entrenched into the hands of undeniable Democrats that it cannot be dislodged by RoveCo's machinations or the fickle fringes of the electorate's vacillations.

And you know what?

I'm cool with that.

As I noted several otterposts back, I am both jaded and cynical. That is the way things work in Washingtoon, and we forget that at our peril.

Tip O'Neill, who as an avuncular magnate has been lauded and quoted ad nauseum on both sides of the aisle, was also a quintessential machine politician. So was Lyndon Johnson. So was Franklin Roosevelt. And so was -- *especially* so was -- FDR's counterfoil Winston Churchill.

Face it, peeps... it's both surfactantly naive and ultimately self-defeating to deny that the canonical smoke-filled rooms exist, to decry the existence of quid-pro-quo back-door dealmakers, to deny the power and the very desirable value of people like Jack Murtha and, yes, Nancy D'Alessandro Pelosi.

While I made no bones about keeping a close eye on people like Murtha under our watch, I also make no bones about valuing them for the same reasons that I am wary of them.

The Democrats need to consolidate their power over the course of the next two years in order to achieve the things that we need them to achieve over the course of the next two decades.

That's just the way it is in the real world, y'all. And so, while it may seem to some of you that I am being inconsistent here, I am cool with the idea that there are people who are very much at ease operating in the back corners of the smoke-filled rooms in which principles get filtered through politics until they turn into practical realities.

So long as they're *our* dealmakers rather than their dealmakers, and so long as *we* are the ones monitoring them rather than team heffalump, then I am willing to accept the inevitable existence of people like Pelosi & Murtha. In fact, I am willing to encourage the success of people like Pelosi and Murtha, because for the first time in many years the likes of them are working for us rather than against us.

I may be a peacemonger but I'm also a pragmatist,
Otter

OMG yall, I don't even know how to describe it just read it!

That is one busted freeper. Holy Cow.

http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Fake_anthrax_hoax_by_conservative_blogger_1113.html

Yupperdoodles, Christy. It is to croggle.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/11/13/01945/776

freepdom's just another word for nothing left to use,
Otter

When Polosi became the head Dem, it was Murtha who sponsered her.
This is plain old payback.

Read this article on the pain felt by the families of those who died.

http://www.commondreams.org/views06/1113-31.htm

Paul Craig Roberts on the mandatory issue of getting our freedoms back.

http://www.counterpunch.org/roberts11132006.html

If those who want to impeach, work thru the process and tell me how 2/3 of the Senate will go along with it?

During the course of hearings, if wrong doing is found we should censure.

But we don't have the votes to do bring any of the Bush cabal to trial and the public will see it as a ploy to harass Bush.

If the Haque can do it fine.

Fix a few broken things first. If we go for impeachment, it will be the only thing that dominates the news.

If we go for impeachment, the Senate will go Repub as well as the POTUS in 2008.

I would like to see BushInc thrown in the darkest reaches of abu Ghraib or Gitmo. It isn't going to happen. We don't have and will never have the Senate votes until Bush is out of office.

This is our chance to give progressive programs the importance and seriousness they deserve. We must not waste the oppurtunity.

You can take two thirds of the Senate by revealing georgies crimes.

His supporters will chew off their own arms to get away from him.

Rats. Burning ship.

Follow the money. It will put the coincident theory to rest forever.

Posted by: battlebob at November 13, 2006 05:21 PM

I don't sincerely believe 2/3 of the Senate will favor impeachment. They're all too entrenched in the financial gain of the oil corporations, pharmaceutical corporations, PACs, etc. (Sadly, yes; even some Dems who have been there for too many years and are not remembering that Clinton was impeached for far less reason; at least his lie about a blow job didn't result in deaths of innocents.)

Even with a Dem majority, I don't honestly believe much will be accomplished on anything in the next two years, least of all repealing all the bad legislation that makes a president a dictator and impeaching him for his known war crimes. I noticed on tonight's BBC news sound byte, Bush said Syria knows "my" position, and talked about "my" administration - no reference to the rest of the country; everything is business as usual, everything is how Bush wants it, and the only "consensus" is how to bow to the will of GWB, as usual.

That's why I hope the World Court at The Hague takes it out of the hands of our Congress Critters who have proven they can't get a consensus on anything other than how to follow Bu$h's dictatorial rule. Already there's nothing but talk, talk, talk, and no action whatsoever about getting the troops out of Iraq, and meanwhile, people are still dying for the sake of lies and oil. The new people in Congress may have won only because voters are against more neoCon "strategy" that gets us nowhere, but the elected Congress Critters will still have to prove they can accomplish something. If those accomplishments do not include repealing bad legislation and impeachment for known war crimes (invasion, torture, concentration camps), plus other crimes we know about or suspect, and others we don't have a clue about yet, then the 110th Congress will be just as ineffective as the 109th Congress. They mostly act like a bunch of children trying to jockey for power positions on the playground, and that accomplishes nothing.

I personally believe the 110th Congress will be another do-nothing Congress, so the only solution to seeing JUSTICE done for those who have died for the sake of lies and oil will have to be if/when the criminals in charge of this nation are brought to trial at The Hague.

Pelosi's agenda? Fine. Those bills can be written now, which is enough time for everyone to read them. They can be voted on in the House on January 4, and in the Senate shortly thereafter. All of Pelosi's things can be accomplished in less than a month, if the Congress will DO SOMETHING other than bicker and vie for playground power.

But there MUST be an accounting for the criminals in charge of this nation; if not, let the grown-ups at The Hague do it for us....

Lieberman refuses to close door on switching parties
http://www.boston.com/news/local/connecticut/articles/2006/11/12/lieberman_refuses_to_close_door_on_switching_parties/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I'm so sure... like he would walk away from his committee chairmanship

Posted by: battlebob at November 13, 2006 05:21 PM

2/3rds may not agree at this very minute but when investigations start, and the media starts reporting things, then momentum will change.

I have to agree with Christy's comment on it.

By time investigations are rolling, the Republicans will either stand with a known war criminal and be damned themselves (for re-election) or they'll "chew off their own arm to get away from Bush/Cheney."

Administration Opposes Democrats’ Plan for Negotiating Medicare Drug Prices
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/13/washington/13medicare.html?_r=2&adxnnl=1&oref=slogin&adxnnlx=1163430334-QM+q+ykfPFDSWPy8WPoV0g&oref=slogin

Changing the subject to something we can all agree on...

Fixing the economy by investing in America
note: Clinton did most of this and it worked pretty well.

http://www.tompaine.com/articles/2006/11/13/investing_in_america.php

http://www.tompaine.com/articles/2006/11/13/no_exit_strategy.php
No Exit Strategy
Ray McGovern
Those expecting the Baker-led Iraq Study Group to propose any kind of pullout will be sorely disappointed.
Excerpt:
The Iraq Study Group is headed by former Secretary of State James Baker and the always eager to co-chair, co-star of the 9/11 commission whitewash , former Democrat Congressman Lee Hamilton. Other members of the Iraq Study Group are: Lawrence Eagleburger (who just replaced Robert Gates), Vernon Jordan, Edwin Meese, Sandra Day O’Connor, Leon Panetta, William Perry, Charles Robb and Alan Simpson. Also “bipartisan” are the group’s “Expert Working Groups” and “Military Senior Advisor Panel.” There sit a truly remarkable congeries of ideologues, think-tankers and captains of industry—sprinkled all too lightly with non-ideological former government officials with substantive expertise—like Larry Diamond, Chas Freeman and Wayne White.

We are told that all are sworn to secrecy on the substance of ISG discussions. But some are speaking openly about the issues at hand. Baker has said publicly he thinks it would be wise to include Syria and Iran in discussions on Iraq. And Panetta has commented on what he learned from U.S. military, intelligence and diplomatic briefers when the ISG spent three days in Baghdad in early September. “We left some of those sessions shaking our heads over how bad it is in Iraq,” said Panetta, adding that private assessments are “much more grim” than what one hears from the administration in public.

{{{Here's what I don't get: WHY are these armchair generals sitting around "discussing" anything about a war that was a lost cause from it's inception, since the invasion itself was a war crime and therefore no "victory" was possible...? Bring our guard and reserve troops home where they belong! Too many have already died for lies and oil.}}}

Jacques Sapir | What's Not Going to Change: After the Electoral Earthquake
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/111306H.shtml
French political analyst Jacques Sapir warns Le Monde readers that the American political tendencies that produced the Bush administration are neither dead nor altogether absent from the Democratic Party.

William Fisher | Arrogant to the End
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/111306A.shtml
William Fisher writes: "... even in the event that the president announces some major new initiatives to extricate us from our Middle East quagmire, his government appears to lack the competence to execute those new initiatives. On the basis of this administration's record, all of us can be excused for being just a tad skeptical - and very afraid."

Excerpt:
One final thought about the Baker-Hamilton Commission: Can anyone imagine that it would ever have occurred to Franklin Roosevelt to outsource the decision about the Normandy landing in World War Two?

Truthout: Impeachment and the Table
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/111306Z.shtml
Truthout believes that by stating flatly that "impeachment is off the table," incoming Speaker Pelosi and incoming Chairman Conyers appear to have erred rather substantially. Impeachment, of course, is a matter of Constitutional law, not personal discretion on the part of individual lawmakers. The pre-emptive nature of the decision by Pelosi and Conyers stands in sharp contrast to every principal of law enforcement. Congress - whether controlled by Democrats or Republicans - has a solemn duty to uphold and when necessary enforce the law.

Excerpt:
The Constitution provides impeachment as a remedy for "high crimes and misdemeanors." It is important to note that the category at issue is high crimes. We are mired in a military operation, with no end in sight and a human toll approaching catastrophic in proportion. Impeachment raises its head in this dialog because evidence exists that Mr. Bush and other White House officials may have deliberately misled the nation on the road to Baghdad. Deliberately. If true, the law itself mandates action under due process. Such action is expressly non-discretionary.

During the Iraq Resolution debate, a white-haired Robert Byrd of West Virginia stood on the floor of the Senate and argued with a haunting passion that the Congress did not, under Constitutional law, have the right to reassign war-making power to the president. It was, he implored, an abandonment of Congressional duty. Maybe that old man knew what he was talking about after all.

I think Pelosi was wrong also. The idea is to investigate the run-up to 9/11. The no-bid contracts, the cooked evidence, the absurd low estimates of troops and costs...
A bottoms-up approach should be taken. Have the hearings to find out the scope and how to correct the problems. If during the hearings to solve problems, bad stuff is found then by all means go after the evil doers.
But the idea of just deciding to impeach without even considering other problems is wrong.
The smart way is to try and solve problems and deal with illegal stuff along the way.
In this way, the public might support us in 2008.
It isn't hard to show just how messed up Bush is. It maybe harder to turn Bush’s actions into impeachable offenses. There is a big difference and Bush will drag it out as long as possible to force Dems to divert attention away from fixing problems.
I want Dems to stay in power for a long time. If they can nail Bush, great but it must not be the primary goal. The primary goal must be to solve problems.
Think of throwing Bush in the slammer collateral damage. Sorry George, we meant to fix problems, but you just got in the way.
We really need to be very calculating on this to both do real progress cleaning up Bush's actions and go after the legality of Bush's actions.
Both are equally important. I think we start with clean-up and see where the legal road takes us.
It would really help that we show how immoral Bush was at every step of the way as we work to solve the problems. We must have lots of public support on this.
If we start with impeach first, the media will ignore everything and the only task will be impeachment. After two years, the public will kick us out.
What may be the most important goal is flushing conservativism down the drain. Because if we don't do that, we will be facing smarter conservatives.

There's a couple folks in the IRC if you want to come join in.

Won't guarantee how long they'll be there but they're chatting away right now.

Giuliani - ho hum. 300 million people in this country and the same candidates keep popping up.

Excerpt:

Politics - not religion - lies at the root of a growing divide between Muslim and western societies, according to a report presented to the UN secretary general, Kofi Annan, yesterday.
An international panel of scholars, politicians and religious leaders warned that cultural stereotypes were turning negotiable disputes into "seemingly intractable identity-based conflicts" and that the clash-of-civilisations theory has obscured "the real nature of the predicament the world is facing".

In their recommendations the 20-strong panel, which included Nobel peace prize winner Desmond Tutu and former Iranian president Mohammad Khatami, suggested steps towards defusing the crisis, including an urgent reinvigoration of the Middle East peace process and initiatives aimed at the young.

Read the rest at http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,,1946956,00.html

"I'm going to leak something to the Iraq study commission, with Jim Baker and Lee Hamilton. Why stop at asking Syria and Iran to help us out? Why not go all the way? Ask the North Koreans for some assistance. Bring in Hugo Chavez."

Rush Limbaugh

Talk about out of touch.

It seems everybody's posturing, just like they're campaigning. No one's genuine. You've got Blair and Ohlmert trying to act tough, insisting they won't talk to Iran. You've got Howard and Blair, insisting on diplomacy. The Iraq Study Group won't have all it's recommendations ready til after Thanksgiving. There is always somebody who has to try to look tough.

Panacea Of Pelo...see-a...nothing.

Nancy...get a grip.

I just had a client pay 1.8 million dollars to a group of 15-20 citizens represented by a lawyer procured by a city councilman to avoid having a rezoning permit denied by the councilman's "people".

The councilman, James Carter, is also a decon in the church who he (behind the scenes) defended all because his revererand, Reverand Wardswaorth demaded it be so.

So...oh yes my lovelies, it gets better...now the investor/developer wants me to design and get permitted a plan so loathsomely less than what was previously designed and approved that I am about to turn states evidence against my boss, my client and the bastard councilman.

Keep looking towards New Orleans...

We never cease to amaze.

Indy

Posted by: aimzzz at November 13, 2006 07:22 PM

As I have said before, let Liebermann vote for Reid, and then refuse to let him caucus anymore with the Dems. Nearly every vote in the Senate is going to be close, but if Lieberman is seen as siding with the Republicans on oil drilling, judges, choice, wages, social security, education and health care his Senatorial career will be over. The main reason he was re-elected was he is considered to be a moderate with Democratic leanings. If he walks away from that role, he is done, and he knows it. His career is what matters most to him.

Don't give him any power. He can't be trusted.

Any thoughts?

Posted by: Indy at November 13, 2006 11:19 PM

New Orleans sounds like the Chicago of the South, but with a little more flare.

Don't give him any power. He can't be trusted.
Posted by: oncall at November 13, 2006 11:22 PM

What oncall said... I agree.

Lieberman has consistently voted with neoCons. That tells me he's a DINO. So far, I've not seen one single thing where any DINO can be trusted.

Oncall:

I'm with you on Lieberman, but how would you address this? Here's a guy that, as far as I can see, has no loyalties to any person or any principle, and here he is in a position to "take my ball and go home" if he doesn't get his way (i.e., flip parties). My gut tells me to call his bluff, give him nothing, and if he does switch parties then it may well be the nail in the coffin of every national GOP politician from New England and make life living hell for Joe Lieberman. So, Joe, make my day... How lucky do you feel? My two-cents anyway. That guy just steams me but thanks to the good folks of Connecticut that is who we have to deal with.

Chuck in Houston

There must be a more constructive way to deal with "Joe-mentum" (otherwise known as no-mentum) than the one I suggested above. Got to think of a postive solution. Just can't live that negative way, if you know what I mean, make way, for the positive day.

Chuck in Houston

Give Joe the job of rooting out pork-barrel riders -- that's it! What do they call those things anyway? There is some term of art for that which I can't recall. Keep him away from foreign policy! Let him prove is creds jin domestic issues! There's a win-win!

Chuck in Houston

How odd that a thread on Chafee ends up being about old Joe. There is some deep irony in that which I am still pondering.

Chuck in Houston

Hah! I've got it! Let "Old Joe" switch parties in exchange for the "Chafee Down-Easters" -- let's flip Susan Collins or Olympia Snowe --I think they would be much more comfortable as key players in a Democratic Senate than in a Republican Senate controlled by Old Joe. And I think Maine would reward them. (When is Snowe up for re-election?) Or maybe I'm just crazy.

Finest kind!

Chuck in Houston

OK, I think I've got it:

Old Joe/Warner on Armed Services
Biden/Hagel on Foreign Relations.

This gives Baker/Gates a chance and we can't do that in a partisan manner and we can't screw that up.

Meanwhile, back in the states...

Kerry on Intelligence because Rockefeller just hasn't carried the ball (remember, Kewrry has a law degree and is a former prosecutor).

Leahy on Justice? I'd prefer Barbara Boxer but I'm open to suggestions -- needs to be a legal-eagle. Maybe Hillary Clinton? She's a good lawyer and tough on cross-examination.

As per the law of the jungle, the real accountability of the Bush administration at law will come from investigations into illegal wire-tapping and strong-arming the Department of Energy into hushing up their findings with respect to those stupid tubes while leaking to Judith Miller an opposite impression -- domestic jurisdiction pure as spring-water. While tying up these loose ends, we'll just see where the evidence leads.

Anybody savvy that?

Chuck in Houston

Enough of my stupid arm-chair quarterbacking already! We'll just have to leave it up to our Senators to work out the intricacies of the Senate. Not my pay-grade.

Chuck in Houston

I can see clearly now the rain is gone.
I can see all obstacles in my way.
Gone are the dark black clouds that held me down.
It's gonna be a bright, bright, bright sunshiney day.

Posted by: Chuck at November 13, 2006 11:51 PM

Can a state recall its Senator? Maybe the good citizens of Connecticut will decide they really did not want a Republican after all.

Oncall:

As I understand it, unlike states (e.g., California), federal elective offices (e.g., Senate seats) are subject to rules prescribed in the Constitution. In other words, as I understand it, we don't get "do-overs."

Or, as they say, CT errs in haste, we repent at leisure....

But this can't be a principle issue. We'll get around it. Vox populi and all that....

Chuck in Houston

Posted by: NonnyO at November 13, 2006 06:53 PM

Excellent post Nonny.

I think you touched on exactly what we all sense to be true and that is really nothing is going to get done legislatively for the next two years.

You know it is real good and nice to take a deep breath and say something to the effect of, 'Lets fix some of the broken things first'.

But to say that you are under the assumption that georgie will just LET YOU fix what he has broken.

Even with a majority, slim or not, he has spent all this time usurping the powers of the House and Senate and he already has backdoors built into all the firewalls of this once great republic.

Pelosi, Murtha, Reid, none of them can 'fix' anything until the actual problem is dealt with, namely george w. bush.

Even with both chambers in our hands, the Supreme Court is still stacked with his and his daddys friends.

It is all good to be hopeful that he will ALLOW you to fix something he deliberately broke, but it is just not very realistic.

Georgie is going to spend the next two years grinding this nation into the mud as he desperately avoids being called to account for ANYTHING.

One thing he will not be doing is respecting the new leaders of Congress, or helping them in any way undo the damge he has caused.

Bipartisian consensus only works as long as georgie is willing to be usurped.

I think all of us know deep down that will just never happen. His daddy and his daddys friends will not allow that to happen.

The only way to begin to 'fix' anything he has done is to impeach him and get the damn trials over with.

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/111306M.shtml

The Unfinished Story of Election 2006: We Get to Choose the Ending
By Ira Chernus * Sunday 12 November 2006

"Election statistics are like pies. You can slice them up any way you want. And the way you slice them depends on the tool you use. My favorite tool is a nugget of wisdom from Democratic political guru Stanley Greenberg: "A narrative is the key to everything." The party that tells the best story wins. And the recipe for a winning story is simple: Take a few handfuls of fact, throw in a large dollop of fiction, and stir."

more at link

Chuck, I enjoy reading your posts. :-)

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/14/washington/14health.html

Health Insurance Industry Urges Expansion of Coverage
By ROBERT PEAR * Published: November 14, 2006
WASHINGTON, Nov. 13 — The health insurance industry proposed an expansion of Medicaid and new tax breaks on Monday with the goal of guaranteeing coverage for all children in three years and for virtually all adults within 10 years.

More at link

DiAnne, I think the Guardian article you linked on November 13, 2006 10:05 PM and the Truthout article I posted on November 14, 2006 08:16 AM are complimentary when read in full.

Already out-of-date, but I found these snapshots of what could end up on the Democratic agenda interesting:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=6464897

New Timetables, Phased Pullout Likely for Iraq
~~by Tom Bowman
Rethinking Direct Talks with Iran, North Korea
~~by Michele Kelemen
How Will a Democratic Congress Approach Taxes?
~~by Chris Arnold
Health Care: A New Beginning
~~by Julie Rovner
Renewed Push to Raise the Minimum Wage
~~by Frank Langfitt
Finding Common Ground with Bush on Immigration
~~by Jennifer Ludden
Revisiting the Sept. 11 Panel's Recommendations
~~by Pam Fessler
Climate Change to Get Congressional Hearing
~~by Elizabeth Shogren

Tonight I watched an American documentary called, "Lost Year in Iraq". I think at some point it was mentioned that there had only ever been two presidents impeached - Andrew Johnson in 1867 for a few illegal practices. Acquitted. Not responsible for human deaths or mental and physical disfigurements?

Bill Clinton - impeached for perjury and obstruction of justice. Yeah - he lied about the sex between himself and Monica someone. They weren't the first, nor will they be the last. That's really no one's business except the two people concerned and their families. Again, no human deaths or mental and physical disfigurements. What a waste of public money that was!!

And now, with more than half a million "collateral damage" Iraqi civilian deaths and plenty of mental and physical disfigurements, in Iraq alone; plus, thousands of Americans who died in Afghanistan, Iraq and on 9/11; what I'm hearing is "let it go." George Bush isn't concerned. He is so dumb that he doesn't have a clue that he's wrong over heaps and heaps of issues.

How do you say sorry to the dead and their families, if you don't impeach?

How do you say sorry to the dead and their families, if you don't impeach?

Posted by: woz at November 14, 2006 08:45 AM

Amen!

Bush won't listen to Blair or Howard so far. So he's not going to listen to any Democrats. He's going to keep things as partisan as he can. He's afraid of what Rush Limbaugh will think. He's still rebelling against Daddy. His way (or the highway) hasn't worked yet he narcissistically carries on, staying the course. He'll encounter more pressure but he'd rather listen to Ohlmert than Blair or Howard, and are all those Navy vessels and aircraft still surrounding Iran that were there for those exercises? Hope the honeymoon's not over. No attacks or terror alerts before the election but the lame duck can still hobble on.

Christy
Some of the dead and their families in this country still blindly support Bush.

Your last line is a real kicker, woz.

But I think we start with the investigations and the oversight that Congress is supposed to provide. And then we see what develops.

BTW, welcome to DCP -- I haven't said hello yet but I'm really pleased to say hi to a friend of Otters from downunder.

Dianne,

Bush will always have atleast 12% support no matter what is revealed about him.

Those 12% are the ones we reffer to as 'The Busheviks'.

They could catch him clubbing Pelosi to death while raping a puppy and still believe it is all bill clintons fault.

Those 12% is not enough to protect georgie from being accountable to the rest of us.

I draw the line at puppy raping.

Who let the gods out?

In fact, I do not even think that 12% would hold for him.

I have always thought busheviks were a very small part of our population but they are the ones willing to scream the loudest and fight the dirtiest.

I doubt georgies true base is even 6% firm.

The rest are just trying to keep from being implicated themselves.

You know what the busheviks remind me of? Seriously....

A toad that swells itself up to appear 4 times bigger than it really is.

It has never stopped the toad from being eaten by a determined predator that understands the true size of the toad and is willing to pop his bubble.

They can puff themselves up to appear larger than life, but not one of them will survive a pinprick.

Jeebus, what a strange and wonderful community this here DCP thingie is.

I mean, I don't believe that I have ever read the statement "I draw the line at puppy raping" on a poliblog before, much less have it make total sense in context.

it is indeed to croggle,
Otter

Dozens snatched in mass kidnap at Iraq ministry
Reuters: http://tinyurl.com/vhnva

Yes someone sent me an email this morning that at least 100 had been kidnapped in one go. Sunnis are specifically targeted.

And it appears Howard is going along with Bush not Blair, not wanting phased withdrawal Imultiple sources). Then Ahmadinejad is going to make an appeal to the American people (Raw Story). I think some of these guys hsould listen to the Chinese premier and "just shut up .. it's better to be quiet"

Christy
I think the far left and far right kind of cancel each other out and they do scream the loudest. The middle are being listened to right now, I think. You said you were a liberal hawk and I was wondering if maybe I wan't a conservative dove. No labels though - it's too complex.

I don't think Bush is listening to the Busheviks. I think he's after the oil. Iran has oil, Venezuela has oiil, North Korea does not to my knowledge have oil. It matters.

Barf bag, plz...

Giuliani moves toward 2008 presidential bid
Reuters: http://tinyurl.com/v8kyk

Also Bush does not want the middle having a say, let along the left. Even if the "pragmatists" from the old school have a pull on him, the "ideologues" from the neocon camp do too. Maybe he's had a phone call from Condi or Cheney told him just to plug his ears.

Aimzz 09:40 AM
Yeah.. sick, predictable. The usual suspects.

Howard will do whatever he has too to keep it from being revealed how he was blackmailed into involving Aussi troops into Iraq.

Namely an old Oil For Food scheme that netted Howie and freinds some major cash.

I say send georgie and the poodle to the Hague and let the Aussis force Howard to watch.

Maybe then there will be no more lies between our people. And maybe then our friends will forgive us for getting them into this God awful mess.

Japan can hold nuclear arms for self-defense: govt
Reuters: http://tinyurl.com/v2mfa

DiAnne, Mark did a quick blog on the middle today.

"The Democratic challenge is to govern well, not to appeal to some mythical ideological center. Because there isn’t one."
~~Mark Barrett
http://www.thepremise.com/

Also, if you get a chance: re: the importance of peace groups: http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/111306M.shtml
"The Unfinished Story of Election 2006: We Get to Choose the Ending"
~~By Ira Chernus

http://www.thepremise.com has interesting stuff on the left and right in the first two topics up now. If the left and right ends of the spectrum and activist and ideological, and the middle is pretty pragmatic and only comes alive when they want something done that isn't getting done, then the Democrats need to prove they can DO something, and better than the Republicans.

KJ
ESP

Christy
I don't care if they send Howard too.

Aimzz
Now Japan can be our proxy as well as Israel - get the action started then the neocons have an excuse to take North Korea and Iran out with nukes. There are those on the right who actually advocate for that - lots of crazies.

ha! ;-)

Dianne I agree the two extreams do tend to cancel each other out but only if and unless one does not have extraordinary powers over the other.

There is no 'extreame left' in this nation. It has been totally obliterated and destroyed.

My God, they are openly labling 'liberals' as TERRORISTS on Foe News! What liberal, with all that means, what peacnik is going to stand alone against such... terror....?

The news does not report the news anymore because the truth has a well known 'liberal bias'.

In almost every case but this one I would absolutely agree with you, that they would naturally balance, but the 'extreame left' was probably the first thing georgie and his people methodically did away with.

They had too because it was the most immediate threat to their radical ideology.

In most cases it is best to assume it is balanced, in this case, it is lethal to make that assumption.

The extream left is gone, there is only US....

And THEM.

There is no middle ground. There is the have mores and then there is the rest of us.

We can only restore that balance by also obliterating the extream right.

And then a new natural balance will emerge, and as long as our Constitution remains intact, the middle ground will once again be floated between them.

What being a 'liberal hawk' means:

I am willing to live in peace with the dove and even admit their ways in many regards are superior to a hard life of fighting.

Pacifisim is preffered, but Gods Rules rarely allow the pacifist to die peacefully.I would rather eat the dove than starve to death.

I believe in evolution, but it is not the smartest, the strongest, or even the most kind that will 'evolve'.

The ones that will survive us are the ones willing to do whatever it takes to survive, wether that means peace or war so be it.

I am a liberal because I want to be. I am a hawk because I have to be.

Without Hawks, there would be nothing but open air standing between the doves and the vultures.

Kill 'em all, let their gods sort 'em out.

nuthin but nyet,
Otter

Christy
Yes there isn't much a a true ideological left in this country - it's too far into hypercapitalism and globalization. You would have to go into South America to find it, or Central America? We are too rich. The right have gone further to the right and been given more voice in my lifetime than I ever remember. That's why it has been good in this election to see them smacked down just a little.

Did you all (or y'all) see that where we had Nancy Pelosi we may now have Trent Lott (House Minority Leader)? I thought he was down for the count.

On another subject, I was listening to NPR on the road - all about the kidnappings in Iraq but also about 41's team being brought in now. I actually heard a 1991 tape of Cheney saying NOT to go into Iraq because it would just be a quagmire. What happened?!! Cheney, Rummy and Wolfie are all alumnis of the Gerald Ford administration and Tony Snow used to be a speechwriter for Bush's father. Incest.

Left blogistan's civics lesson and organizing citizens' oversight of Congress

Here's a great demonstration of the power of the blogosphere and of dailykos. Look at what’s been organized based on comments. This diary traces its evolution over the weekend. The blogosphere is about to get a major civics lesson in how government works.

Congressional Committees Project ... please join us!
by annan [Subscribe]
Mon Nov 13, 2006 at 03:05:04 PM EST

Over the weekend the most amazing thing happened here at dKos. A trilogy of diaries inspired events that led to what I have dubbed The Stone Soup Project, but is officially known as the Congressional Committees Project and has shown up in the Open Threads as Adopt a Congressional Committee!

read the rest here...
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/11/13/1554/8176

Am gonna be tied up for the AM so had to read fast but in summary, I think it's possible Bush may bend a little more to his new masters but won't til he has to. If he starts to plan to withdraw down troops, doubt he'll want a public timetable. Iraq study group teleconferenced with Blair today (it's afternoon now in UK) and they'll eventually meet with Rummy, Rice, Negroponte, Hayden (CIA), Iraq ambassador & top general. Someone needs to listen. It's all morbidly interesting (literally). Bagdad is so dangerous the universities have closed down for now. There is no way to know who belongs to a militia, as there are so many infiltrators. Keep hearing about stolen uniforms and missing weapons. Al-Maliki met with General Abizaid and Iraq may itself engage with Iran and Syria. Iraq hasn't had diplomatic relations with Syria for 20 years, as they could do more to keep insurgents from coming in through their borders. How independent is Al-Maliki from our control and who is he affiliated with? Do we even have enough power there any more to install puppets?

I think we should grapple with the fact Iraq is a total and complete loss.

None of us can stop the civil war there, the only thing we can hope for is to contain it within their own borders, but I am afraid we already may be too late for that as well.

Too many refugees and old scores to settle.

The only thing that could possibly stop it and insert a moment of sanity is to impeach and punish the one who caused it.

Ah, yes. And/or argh. Argh on a stick with sprinkles on it, even.

In truly dKossackistani fashion, one can follow the link dw just gave us and then scroll down through screen after screen after screen of self-congratulatory recursive auto-crapola before/without ever quite managing to figure out just what the hell everybody is so busy patting themselves on the back for in the first place.

Whatever it was, I was sure that it must be worthwhile or someone as savvy as dwahzon would not have bothered pointing us to it in the first place. So I keep on scrolling and kept on parsing until I figured out, or at least I think I might have figured out, just what the hell the thread and its associated wiki entry was nominally talking about.

And so, after a certain amount of thrashing, I was able to grok and agree with dw that the somewhat-unoriginal so-yclept Stone Soup Project is, in fact, probably a pretty Good Thing.

But, oh dear goddess, the signal-to-noise ratio on the Daily Kos website is just *so* incredibly low sometimes...

just dkos well now baby just dkos,
Otter

Scientists abducted in daylight raid on Baghdad institute
Associated Press

BAGHDAD — Gunmen wearing Interior Ministry commando uniforms kidnapped about 25 scientists and other staff members from a Baghdad research institute directly under the Ministry of Higher Education, police said.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20061114.wiraqscientists114/BNStory/International/home

"Stone Soup" was the name of a band I used to follow. They split years ago but singer/songwriter Carrie Newcomer still performs.

I followed the dKos links and think it's probably a good idea for collective work. But yeah, the noise level seems a bit high. Probably just initial excitement?! :-)

Sorry otter. Should have pointed out the dkosopedia link that was like the 1st or 2nd link in the diary so you could go straight there.

In this case, the meat of the diary was in the embedded links that it put together in chronicling how the concept developed. But you know, don't bother going over dailykos if it annoys you that much.

This article by Ron Kovic (yes, that Ron Kovic) titled "The Forgotten Wounded of Iraq" was published at truthdig in Jan 2006 and has been available for comment since then. It found new life in October and November in terms of active commenting and dialogue. The 2 pages, long pages, of comments have some remarkable stories from recent veterans and family members of active duty people.

The whole thing is extraordinary and heart-wrenching.

http://www.truthdig.com/dig/item/forgotten_wounded_20060117/

How do you say sorry to the dead and their families, if you don't impeach?
Posted by: woz at November 14, 2006 08:45 AM

RIGHT ON!

You said it much better than I did!

All those people died in vain for the sake of LIES and oil. I want justice for the dead who died for no good reason.

Posted by: dwahzon at November 14, 2006 12:59 PM

I know I've mentioned this before, but I a few years ago I interviewed a young Marine home from Iraq. He had severe head trauma and short-term memory loss. He wanted the interview (his brother called us.) It was by far the most excruciating conversation I've ever had with another human being. We/he talked about his time in Iraq for over an hour. Every few minutes he would say, "Have I already told you that?" because he couldn't remember from one minute to the next what he'd said. It was all I could do to keep from crying in front of him. His first child was born the day after we talked. I manufactured a reason to go back to see him on my own and we chatted for a little bit and hugged for the longest time. I will never forget him, never. Absolutely heartbreaking. And he was only one of how many?

I also interviewed a chaplain who volunteered to leave his wife and two young sons and go to Iraq, because he felt called to do what he could in his capacity as chaplin. Take about courage and committment... these people deserve(d) so much more than they will ever see from the neocons. Ever ever ever see from those midgets who call themselves men.

And I want to take care of them and take care of Americans with no health insurance (disclosure, I am one) and get out of Iraq in a way that is best for the people in that country, as well as our own.

Impeach? Not now. Way too much to do first. Bush doesn't deserve to be first on list for anything but disgust and contempt. There is plenty of time to deal with him later. These other people have suffered long enough.

But I'm just one opinion, and am under no illusion that anything I have to say will change anyone else's mind about the where and when's of GWB's payback.

Maturity in governing matters, and immaturity is all we've gotten for well over a decade, specially the last 6 ... six... six years.

The key now for dems is to prove they can govern and influence with genuine maturity, and the peaches will fall where they may.

Off With Their Hate

And... ;-) GWB isn't worth taking up all the oxygen in the country for another two years. Congress has work to do. Besides, I'd rather see GWB hung by his shorts in an international court. (With apologies to the late Johnnie Cochran.)

It is not like we can not walk and chew bubble gum at the same time.

Before you fix it, you must make sure georgie will never have the power to break it again.

That power must be stripped from him.

He will never let himself be usurped.

He is a paranoid meglomaniac. And he will never just let you walk in and take it all back.

George W. Bush is FAR MORE dangerous now than he was last month. And next month is liable to get flat out freaky CRA-ZY.

We must be ready to stop him once and for all. The death toll is only going higher.

No more playing games with psychopaths.

Impeach him ASAP.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061114/ap_on_go_co/congress_7
Senate Democrats decide on party leaders
WASHINGTON - Senate Democrats picked two women for senior posts Tuesday, and their choice as majority leader, Sen. Harry Reid (news, bio, voting record), said a top priority is getting a new secretary of defense confirmed.

{{{Harry Reid favors Gates.... I think the old boy is losing his marbles. Doesn't Reid remember Iran-Contra and Gates' role in it? Stoopid is as stoopid does. Gates is Rummy in a different body.}}}

You think georgie can not take out our little hard won majority...? That he has no choice but listen to you on any level...?

All it would take is for say, Murtha, to be nailed very publicly with say, corruption charges.

Bam, overnight you got dethroned in the eyes of the people. On Murtha that would stick like glue and the whole Iraq war will be blamed on him and his war pig friends who give him money. How dare they!

Yes, it would cause a 'backlash'.

Of course georgie would like to start a civil war. He is a war profiteer after all.

You think they have not already thought of such things...? They are enacting a radical take over of the number one war prize on earth, the United States of America.

KBR already have the damn detainment facilities built. When exactly do you think they will start using them?

As soon as they have too and as soon as all opposition has been gutted and left to die.

Right or wrong smearing Murtha would work. Ask McCain.

Chance favors the prepared mind and those carrying a big stick.

I really do wonder does those 'facilities' have banks of industrial ovens...? It would not be the first time a bush had a hand in such things.

In case you're wondering what happened within the Lamont race, this kos diary explains alot.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/11/14/122820/27

There is nothing wrong with diplomacy. India & Pakistan are talking peace again. Bush talked to the automakers and is headed to Vietnam, but he won't probably deal with the Iraq Study Group til after Thanksgiving. They won't make final recommendations until they come to a consensus and they're half Democrat, half Republican, but Tony Blair has weighed in on side of diplomacy.

So far, I think our best hopes are to:
1. focus on ending the Israeli/Palestine conflict
2. stabilize Lebanon using UN peacekeepers
3. enter dialogue with Syria and Iran
4. set stronger terms with Iraqi government
5. begin a phased withdrawal

We finally have some balance of power. We need some bipartisan consensus that results in action. I would love to see us give it a try, and don't have a problem with Gates replacing Rumsfeld as it's a door to pragmatists rather than ideologues. I think Murtha should be given a chance, as a bridge between moderates and progressives. I don't know why Harry Reid won't be a good Senate Majority leader and speaking of corruption, I was told a few things about him by locals when in Vegas. We need to be realistic. All in all, I think things are shaping up a little at a very desperate time in history.

Bush: Immigrants May Be Held Indefinitely
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/111406Z.shtml
Immigrants arrested in the United States may be held indefinitely on suspicion of terrorism and may not challenge their imprisonment in civilian courts, the Bush administration said Monday, opening a new legal front in the fight over the rights of detainees.

{{{THIS is why the Military Commissions Act of 2006 MUST be repealed IMMEDIATELY. I hope Pelosi will include it on her list of the first things to do, and I hope Leahy does the same in the Senate. It's not ONLY immigrants who can be held indefinitely, but also any citizen of the US that the pretzelnitwit deems an 'enemy' for whatever paranoid reason he imagines!!! THIS is also WHY impeachment MUST be put back on the table. The reps and senators must write the legislation now that they plan on fixing come Jan. 4 and after so that reps and senators have a chance to read what they're voting on, but make repealing MCA '06 one of the top three things to vote on, if not the first thing to vote on!!! Habeas corpus is a right that has been around for 900 years, and it's an accepted legal principle. Without habeas corpus, we have nothing but the remaining parts of the MCA '06 bill that make dictators out of presidents, and the rest of the bill has also obliterated the Constitution, the Bill of Rights, the Geneva Conventions, US law, and it makes the US a dictatorship with all the morals of a third world nation.}}}

4:10 Cookie, Delivered Oily

NeoConphuseUs say: One need back the phuque off, take deep cleansing breath or 9, let thy scum hang thyselves...

For they,

Shirley Will

(... and apparently, monkeyhour is well under way)

"All in all, I think things are shaping up a little at a very desperate time in history."
--Posted by: DiAnne at November 14, 2006 03:41 PM

What DiAnne said.

We finally have some balance of power.
Posted by: DiAnne at November 14, 2006 03:41 PM

Au contraire, DiAnne. That's an illusion we still like to cling to.

As long as the Military Commissions Act of 2006 is in effect, TECHNICALLY we are living in a dictatorship, we have no habeas corpus rights, the US Constitution, the Bill of Rights, the Geneva Conventions, and US law are all off the books.

Technically, there is still no balance of power and Bu$hCo knows it. He has 'unitary executive' dictatorial power, thanks to the MCA '06.

NonnyO
We have the potential for more balance of power.

Re. Howard, I got some of my answer. He sounds alot like Bush and indeed will be talking with him in Vietnam. He's obviously worried about Indonesia and is skeptical though not outright rejecting of talks with Syria and Iran. I'm pleased that he does at least view some resolution of the situation between Palestine and Iraq as important, and that he sees it as fueling anti-American sentiment.

Then Rupert Murdoch, owner of Fox, weighs in and of course warns the Australians not to be anti-American like the Europeans.

Meanwhile, South Africa has legalized gay marriage and it's also legal to have a gay civil union in Mexico City.

I meant to say that the situation between Palestine and Israel is crucial (I wrote Iraq instead of Israel). I do not think this can be emphasized enough and neither political party has acknowledged the importance people in the middle east place on this. When Bush came into office, my Iranian friend predicted that something terrible was going to happen because he was repeatedly refusing to place importance on solving the problem. Nor did any political candidate in 2008 link it to the quagmire, nor ws it brought up much in that context when things flared up in Lebanon recently. Now push has come to shove.

We have the potential for more balance of power.
Posted by: DiAnne at November 14, 2006 04:29 PM

Potential, yes.

Current Technical Reality, no.

Our fates are in the hands of the Dem majority just elected, and any true "moderate" Repubs, if our legislators come out of their kool-aide stupors and do what's right by the people who elected them.

There's always "signing statements" - of course - and Dumbya could veto a second bill, which *might* get that toilet paper legislation discussed in Lamestream Media for a change, and in depth, so the kool-aiders understand they could also be thrown in jail without any of the normal rights we had before MCA '06 (if pressure is put on Con legislators, they might be part of a 2/3 majority to over-ride a veto).

I'm thinking that MCA '06 will not be voted on any time soon, the dictator will keep on implimenting PNAC objectives, the war will go on being discussed but no one will pull the troops out of Iraq or Afghanistan (indeed, more guard troops are scheduled to go over there, thus, increasing the troop strength), no one will close Gitmo and other prisons we don't know about.

In short, I don't expect anything to change.

The potential for change is there, yes.

But reality must be dealt with. As long as MCA '06 is in effect, we have a dictatorship, and we do not have any of the rights and privileges granted to us by our Founding Fathers.

Impeach him ASAP.

Posted by: Christy at November 14, 2006 02:23 PM

In a perfect world.

Bush won't listen to Blair or Howard so far.

Posted by: DiAnne at November 14, 2006 09:00 AM

He doesn't have to - Howard's the lap-dog. Whatever Howard's mighty master says, Howard says seconds later. It all spews "parrot-fashion" out of Howard's mouth, just as I heard it on PBS minutes earlier. Howard would never give Bush advice, for fear of - what?? But Georgie Porgie isn't too impressed with Blair right now because Blair is coming up with alternate strategies, and Bush's strategies have worked so far - haven't they???

BTW, welcome to DCP -- I haven't said hello yet but I'm really pleased to say hi to a friend of Otters from downunder.

Posted by: dwahzon at November 14, 2006 09:03 AM

Thanks dwahzon - I'm thoroughly enjoying this blog and look forward to it every day. Thanks everyone.

Christy
Some of the dead and their families in this country still blindly support Bush.

Posted by: DiAnne at November 14, 2006 09:01 AM

But DiAnne - aren't we sorry for the hundreds of thousands of Iraqi civilians we're responsible for killing? Those who blindly support Bush should not make you afraid. Let's face it - Hitler had a lot of support too!

A toad that swells itself up to appear 4 times bigger than it really is.

They can puff themselves up to appear larger than life, but not one of them will survive a pinprick.

Posted by: Christy at November 14, 2006 09:20 AM

LOL at this one Christy because I'd been thinking the exact same thing. Blair, Bush and Howard - the three Cane toads - spreading their compulsory Dictatorships through the middle east - without the faintest idea what Middle-Easterners feel, think, believe, or want. The three toads know better and will FORCE it upon them, whether they like it or not.

Jeebus, what a strange and wonderful community this here DCP thingie is.
I mean, I don't believe that I have ever read the statement "I draw the line at puppy raping" on a poliblog before, much less have it make total sense in context.

it is indeed to croggle,

Posted by: Otter at November 14, 2006 09:21 AM

Who-da thought there would be anything to laugh at. We need to spread more laughter. Crabby people like the 3 toads can just be assigned their own footy field to beat the crap out of each other if thats what they like to do. And not one of them would even swing a punch in case he hurt his fist.

Otter, my online dictionary is still trying to find croggle. :D

I don't think Bush is listening to the Busheviks. I think he's after the oil. Iran has oil, Venezuela has oiil, North Korea does not to my knowledge have oil. It matters.

Posted by: DiAnne at November 14, 2006 09:39 AM

Agree with that Diane. On day one of this catastrophe looming everyone was saying that.