Fitzgerald on Sentencing

Repost from previous thread because I want to...

Like father, like son...Commit a crime, get underlings to take the fall, then pardon [commute] them to keep their mouths shut.

In Christmas of 1992, George Herbert Walker Bush's pardon of Cap Weinberger and other Iran-Contra criminals ensured that Weinberger would never talk under oath about the complicity of Bush in the crimes of Iran-Contra.

Can someone please hit me in the head with a baseball bat repeatedly?

At least then I could blame feeling this way on someone else other than georgie.

ALWAYSSSSS GEORGIE.

**Repost from previous thread**

Methinks Mr. Libby will be "disappeared" sooner rather than later.

Why else this rush to keep him out of prison (but otherwise neither condemn nor pardon any of his crimes) - a prison, after all, where he would only be held for a short two and a half years?

Impeachment does not HAVE TO come before arrest.

CONGRESS can arrest the president.

Now that I think about it, goddamn congress to hell too.

Posted by: Christy at July 2, 2007 10:34 PM

@@@@@@@

No, I do not think the president can be arrested for any federal crime: the Congress - actually the House of Representatives must "impeach" (charge) him with crimes. After the House impeaches, the Senate tries the case - 2/3 majority of the Senate needed for conviction of the president and removal from office.

repost:

The Watergate parallel:

Nixon's guys were sentenced to jail and supposed to keep their mouths shut:

On June 17, 1972, police apprehended five men attempting to break into and wiretap Democratic Party offices. The five men were Virgilio González, Bernard Barker, James W. McCord, Jr., Eugenio Martínez and Frank Sturgis. With two other accomplices[attribution needed] they were tried and convicted in January 1973. All seven men were either directly or indirectly employees of President Nixon's Campaign to Re-elect the President, CREEP, and many people, including the trial judge, John J. Sirica, suspected a conspiracy involving higher-echelon government officials.[citation needed] In March 1973, James McCord, one of the convicted burglars, wrote a letter to Sirica charging a massive coverup of the burglary. His letter transformed the affair into a political scandal of unprecedented magnitude.

(I think the two accomplices not listed above were the ringleaders - Hunt and Liddy who were in the hotel across from the Watergate watching things...)

We all know that the Bushco propaganda machine will be repeating Bush's lies about an excessive sentence. Fitzgerald was wise to come out with this statement today.

Posted by: V at July 2, 2007 10:53 PM

Disappeared a la Ken Lay?

Libby polls at AOL:

Do you agree with Bush's decision?
No 65%
Yes 35%

Total Votes: 237,873
Note on Poll Results

Do you think the original sentence was excessive?
No 63%
Yes 37%

Total Votes: 225,338
Note on Poll Results

I am, not talking about a Federal crime.

I am talking about International crimes and WAR CRIMES.

Crimes they are even now committing and conspiring to cover up. Even while I write this, that is what they are doing.

As I said, it is time to enter a brave new world, one that will set the precedent for all time.

Pelosi said Impeachment is off the table.

FINE!

Someone ask her to her face if she is going to shove WAR CRIMES under the table too?

No more wiggle room, just get to the bottom of it, do it now and quit making excuses.

We do not have any mechinisim in place to seriously deal with war criminals from our own nation, because we never wanted to admit that OUR leaders could actually commit 'war crimes'.

They do it right in our faces and we all just pretend it is not really happening. It was that way before, its that way now.

There is no precedent for trying our own leaders for WAR CRIMES.

It is way past time to set one.

I heard in an interview recently and I can't reference the statement. I don't even remember who made it. Except that it was a man. And he was American. Either a historian or biographer. Maybe.

George W Bush cannot be tried in an international court. He cannot be tried in the Hague. No American citizen can be tried in the Hague.

Sorry - bad memory

As blogger Argyrios pointed out in a dKos post at this URL --

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/7/2/21166/26899

-- it was a bit of a challenge getting all of the felonies, war crimes, and impeachable offenses into one sentence... but s/he managed to do it anyway:

----------

The President has now "granted clemency" to a member of his own administration, who was tried and convicted by a jury of his peers and whose sentence was unanimously confirmed by three judges, for obstruction of justice and perjury in the matter of whether the administration illegally blew the cover of a covert CIA operative working on anti-nuclear proliferation, in order to punish her husband for revealing the lies given in the State of the Union address to mislead this country into an illegal war in which thousands of American soldier have been killed, tens of thousands of American soldiers have been injured, hundreds of thousands of Iraqis have been killed, and millions of Iraqis have been displaced, which was started against the wrong country, destroyed America's reputation and credibility on the world stage, and destabilized the Middle East, threatening our country and our allies all over the world.

IMPEACH NOW.

---------------

because the laws of the land require it of us,
Otter

I don't want him tried in the Hague.

I want him tried RIGHT HERE.

By a jury of his peers.

All American, For Americans.

I want his ass in a US prison and the US law elaborated to DEAL WITH war criminals we find in our midst.

And if he is hanged for the crimes he has committed, I want the hangman to be the biggest corn fed country boy we can find.

Just as a nice touch, we could use a US flag for the noose.

As citizens, can we 'forcefully recall' all living retired US Generals of the US Armed Forces?

All living ones. No matter what age or period of service.

Seriously, by say popular vote, can they be 'recalled to serve We The People' and be compelled to vote on US WAR CRIMES issues?

Can citizens create a body like that?

No, it could not be Generals, too many would be implicated.

What about all living current and former US Ambassadors?

I would get rid of your television and go completely internet.. that is what I did...
Posted by: Ralpheh at July 2, 2007 10:34 PM

Me too, but before the internet, so had to depend on reading and things like NPR and occasional BBC. Never looked back. It's easier to focus, look at source documents, make calls to Congress etc.

Looking at the polls posted - they seem to as usual break down along partisan lines - predictable. The "base" is just a little over the "approval ratings" data. The rest could be the Democrat spectrum and some Independents or even people who are opinionated but too lazy to vote.

What makes me nervous is that there have been plenty of times in history (including now) when countries had dictators but could not get rid of them. It's not unusual for a dictator to be unpopular but remain in power and not reflect the people. It seems we are not immune. Our democracy is/was fragile.

Christy
I vote for the Hague. It's traditional. It needs to be international because the wrongs don't just affect our country. & we who pay war taxes owe a debt to the world too, & also for our inordinant consumption of resources.

I was just reading US News and World Report in the jacuzzi at the gym (nerd) and there was an article about how conservatives fear terrorists and liberals fear global warming - both are to a large extent beyond our control and both sides think the other are kind of afraid of the bogeyman. They didn't offer any alternatives and that's become a really conservative MSM rag anyway. I should use it for toilet paper instead.

Too many big corn fed country boys I've met actually support W and the boys, including most of the ones I grew up with. I think the hangman should be someone like Marilyn Manson - why not?! It should be kind of Gothic. Maybe use the guillotine since the Michael Savage boys are pretty obsessed with beheading.

By the way, Coulter sold my name to Gingrich. Now I can trace how the wingnuts spam the internet.

The Big Dick had his spokesweasel post this statement on his behalf on CNN earlier this evening:

“Scooter has dedicated much of his life to public service at the State Department, the Department of Defense and the White House. In each of these assignments he has served the nation tirelessly and with great distinction. I have always considered him to be a man of the highest intellect, judgment and personal integrity — a man fully committed to protecting the vital security interests of the United States and its citizens. Scooter is also a friend, and on a personal level Lynne and I remain deeply saddened by this tragedy and its effect on his wife, Harriet, and their young children. The defense has indicated it plans to appeal the conviction in the case. Speaking as friends, we hope that our system will return a final result consistent with what we know of this fine man.”

please excuse me I have to go throw up now,
Otter

NMP,

AsAt this point I would take the Hague too.

I don't care anymore I just want him stopped. Stopped Now. Stopped completely.

Stopped so well this can never ever happen again.

Impeachment takes too long, we need INTERVENTION, ASAP.

Arrest him for War Crimes, hand him over, try him here, it don't matter, just stop him before any more people die.

I'd like to see the trial here, though unlike over 100 other nations, we did not join.

http://www.icj-cij.org/homepage/index.php?lang=en

The way I understand it, the World Court handles grievances between nations and the Hague Tribunal handles grievances between individuals or nations v nations and both are at the Hague, Netherlands.

It made me very uneasy that we refused to join.

If Cheney is out of commission at any time, Robert Byrd is in charge of the Senate. If Byrd dies, the Governor of West Virginia is a Democrat and would assign someone else.

Visualize a better country and planet and remember that thoughts have power and are sometimes best not verbalized.

You know, if georgie wants to read my email...FINE.

Listen in on my phone calls to the barbeque lady.... FINE.

Yes, I know it is highly illegal, immoral, and unethical, but he is doing it anyway.

I am not so much worried about putting on some dog and pony show because georgie equates dissenters with potential terrorists.

I want him arrested for TORTURE. And for the war crimes he has committed against a people I have never even met.

Spying on me...? So what, my nieghbor spys on me too every time his wife ain't looking.

He has left a trail of murderous human devastation in his path, him spying on me is the least of it.

So Putin was at Kennebunkport with Shrub and Pappy but they apparently can't call all the shots. "I get the top bunk," said Jr.

Source: Reuters

Putin makes new offer to Bush on missile plan

KENNEBUNKPORT, Maine (Reuters) - Russian President
Vladimir Putin made a new counter-proposal to President
George W. Bush on Monday for reshaping a planned U.S.
missile shield that has strained relations between their
countries.

After talks at the Bush family compound, Bush called
Putin's offer "very innovative" and worthy of study, but
insisted the anti-missile system must still be based in
eastern Europe despite Russia's bitter objections.

-snip-

With the two countries especially at odds over missile
defense, Putin issued a new proposal, expanding on his
surprise offer last month for joint use of Russian radar
in Azerbaijan as an alternative to the U.S. plan.

-snip-

Putin raised the ante on Monday with suggestions to
incorporate a radar system in southern Russia and bring
more European nations into decision-making on missile
defense under the umbrella of the Russia-NATO Council.

-snip-

Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070702/pl_nm/bush_putin_dc

Christy
I think it's ok to use the voodoo doll then.

http://www.cnn.com/

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19570520/

Vote in polls on the Libby sentence commutation

"If Cheney is out of commission at any time, Robert Byrd is in charge of the Senate."

Arrest dick too.

Scooter was working at his direction.

The treasonous act of disclosing Plames identity was done in the commission of a WAR CRIME.

And the conspiracy to cover it up is still ongoing.

I bet Scooters happy today.

Wonder how happy he will be facing a war crimes tribunal..?

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/7/2/113025/1828
Pelosi on Impeachment and Defending the Constitution: It's Just Not Worth It

http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/2007/07/he-warned-us-by-digby-ive-been-enjoying.html
Digby: He Warned Us

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/7/2/214818/8319
Keith Olbermann's Worst Person In The World
W- for today, and why.
Scroll down to the end of the thread for the video.

Dude is a lame duck - thinks he can do anything he wants and sprint to the finish line. Quack quack. He didn't even rely on lawyers to make the decision. He likes to do what he wants. He thinks he is a merciful God meting out clemency, offer forgiveness for transgressions. Justice didn't know what was going on nor did Tony Snow, apparently. Gotta wonder about Cheney. What hypocrisy after vowing to "punish the leaker." Even Bush's father used his power to pardon only as he was leaving office, like other presidents, and not for criminals in his own administration.

NMP,

I hate to tell you this, but don't misunderstand, I love voodoo. But Idon't recommend it.

I grew up studying it. Watching it from afar.

For those whom indulge I will not judge, it is not my place.

But I can not actually practice voodoo.

Theres this whole matter of selling your soul to something I find rather darker than the vibes I prefer to associate with belief.

I am a pagan christian, and voodoo mezmerizes me. But I do not try to usurp the powers of God Himself.

Voodoo works, but I'd think twice before making it work. Everything comes with a price.

Poll:
http://www.time.com/time/
Precisely halfway through 2007, who is Person of the Year so far?
Al Gore
Steve Jobs
Gen. David Petraeus
Vladimir Putin

Al Gore | Moving Beyond Kyoto
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/070207A.shtml
Al Gore writes in The New York Times: "Our home - Earth - is in danger. What is at risk of being destroyed is not the planet itself, but the conditions that have made it hospitable for human beings."
{{{Hmmmm.... Good writing, but I see a bit of political rhetoric creeping in with the rest of his message. I wonder... if Gore will announce his candidacy late in the game and just before any deadlines...? Everyone is already bored senseless with the current crop of politicians, so by next year at this time we'll be ready to dump them in favor of a new face. It would make sense if Gore announced at the last minute, it would be a lot less expensive to run a campaign closer to the normal announcement. We will be so burned out over the current crop of rubber-stamp candidates by the beginning of '08 that drafting Gore or him announcing his candidacy would be a welcome and refreshing change (the Lamestream Media feeding frenzy alone would be priceless)....}}}

Dean Baker | The RX From "SiCKO:" More Choice
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/070207B.shtml
Truthout columnist Dean Baker writes: "The pundits are working overtime trying to defuse the message from "SiCKO," Michael Moore's new film. They are trying to convince the public that the United States could not possibly do what every other rich country (and even some not so rich countries) have managed to do: guarantee their people decent health care."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

The TIMING of the Libby 'commutation' being conveniently when SiCKO is released, and also on a long holiday weekend when precisely no one is paying attention to "news" was mentioned a time or two. Just for $hits and giggles, I channel-surfed in the seconds leading up to local 10 p.m. snooze (and I wanted to find out the weather forecast for tomorrow). The reason for an excess amount of butterflies this year was on one channel as the lead story! Seriously!!! My jaw cracked as it hit the floor...! Four minutes into the news they mentioned the Libby commutation - in passing, with a teaser for an anchor's verbal essay coming up. One of the anchors did do a sixty second essay on the story later and he was a tiny bit critical of the decision.

Und Zo. Likely the only people paying attention to this whole thing are bloggers, Keith Olbermann... and I suspect Jon Stewart's and Steven Colbert's writers are burning some midnight oil about it. Other than that, by the time anyone else might be paying attention sometime next week after the holiday, it will be old news and not mentioned.

Was President Bush right to commute Lewis "Scooter" Libby's prison sentence?

Yes 20%

No 80%

Total: 29597 votes

http://www.cnn.com/

Do you agree with President Bush's decision to commute former White House aide I.
Lewis "Scooter" Libby's prison sentence? *
176579 responses

Yes
29%

No
71%

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19570520/

Now people are really starting to react, the numbers are jumping overwhelmingly against it.

Likely the only people paying attention to this whole thing are bloggers, Keith Olbermann... and I suspect Jon Stewart's and Steven Colbert's writers are burning some midnight oil about it. Other than that, by the time anyone else might be paying attention sometime next week after the holiday, it will be old news and not mentioned.

Posted by: PO'd NonnyO at July 3, 2007 12:49 AM

-----------

Oh for cryin' out loud, Nonny. Stewart and Colbert are both on vacation, it's not the middle of a long week's news blackout anywhere else, the timing of it doesn't have anything at all to do with 'Sicko', and it's not just bloggers and Olbermann who are paying attention to the Libby commutation story.

Today wasn't a holiday, neither is tomorrow. The commutations happened abruptly today because today is the day that the court said Scooter couldn't stay out of jail while awaiting appeal. And this is a *huge* story that's all over the newspapers and TV news shows and NPR and every other kind of MSM venue everywhere. (Even Al-Jazeera and The Age down in Australia are top-paging it already. Sheesh.)

I understand from your long history of posts here that you've got some pretty big biases and blind spots when it comes to the various forms of MSM, bloggers vs. non-bloggers, the government and its minions, and practically everybody else who doesn't already agree with you on the stuff you tend to rant at length about here in the comments threads.

I dig your depth of knowledge on the subjects you care about, and I admire your tenacity, and in many cases I agree with the points that underly your posts. But this constant litany of preaching to the choir can get pretty old sometimes, ya know?

So please, try to take a deep breath and let yourself relax occasionally. Sometimes a cigar really is just a cigar.

Posted by: Otter at July 3, 2007 02:05 AM

Speak for yerself bruthah, I never get tired of being preached to with honest, unfiltered righteous indignation... even if I can't sing for shit.

I can't see blind spots anyway.

The Big Long Drag

Good diary

I can't quit, so I must fight on.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/7/3/9395/69591