What Moves Us?

From the end of the last thread:

"Not liars, but I think sometimes political motivations do play a part," Toobin conceded.

http://rawstory.com//news/2007/Supreme_Court_author_Justice_Souter_wept_0921.html

Posted by: rossiann at September 21, 2007 01:23 PM

I see the comment as a segue to the questions I asked, above. How do our choices inform our opinions?

The Supreme Court (and the lawyers who argued for the Bush side) spent their whole lives behaving in ways that support the Constitution and the voting process. Whatever their internal conflicts, past histories, financial dreams and aspirations, their days were mostly spent defending the Constitution.

SO what changed? What ALLOWED them to change? What motivator was so powerful that they were able to convince themselves to act in ways that directly countered their core practiced behaviors? Do they all have secret lives in which they practice different values and beliefs?

Or are they just comfortable with cognitive and behavioral dissonance?

It moves me to think harder...

The Levin-Reed amendment just failed 47 votes to 47 votes.

Only three Democrat Senators voted against the bill:

Dodd
Pryor
and Nelson (I don't know which one - I will have to check)

Only ONE VOTE was needed for passage of this amendment...

I called Sen. Dodd's office just now and they gave the lame/ running-around-the-bush answer that Sen. Dodd WANTED TO SUPPORT an even STRONGER BILL on Iraq - the Feingold Bill (which I presume has even less of a chance of passage).

I asked why the Senator could not vote for both bills - they really couldn't answer that question...

Hey, if things are so safe & rosey in Baghdad, how come Blackwater is needed for protecting our dicklomats?

11 million people protested on one day in 2003 and it didn't stop the war.

55,000 protested in one day in my city - that's 1 out of 5 people. Many of the rest were sympathetic.

250,000 in SF - that's maybe 1 out of 5 too.

& at least 2/5 more were sympathetic acc/our random sampling

& that was in 2003, BEFORE the war started.

More are against the war now, to varying degrees and for varying reasons. More people are on the bandwagon for better healthcare, more have questions about the economy, more are losing their houses, more are aware of global warming, more know the government failed us during Hurricane Katrina and keep changing excuses (& messing up) in Iraq. & Bin Baden is free.

I think plenty is going on but in alot of directions, converging more at times and for the more global issues. I also think alot of people kind of gave up, to some degree, on protest and civil disobedience when it didn't stop a war they could see would have nothing but tragic consequences.

Two stolen elections didn't help either. I do think the system worked, to some extent in 2006, even with all the cheating - but due to the makeup of our country, we have a few pretty conservative "Blue Dogs" to work with til we get a bigger majority.

People shouldn't give up but it does sometimes seem like one step forward, two steps back. We cannot be a society of immediate gratification when it comes to social change. It may work for everything else but it won't work for that.

Good to see a response to the Jena thing - proves there is still some truth to stimulus-response in general.

Impatience can be as bad as apathy, I think - if it doesn't work, or even backfires.

I also feel that we need international efforts and cooperation, at a single individual level and collectively.

NEW YORK (CNN) -- Conan O'Brien didn't mince words at the VH1 Save the Music Foundation's 10th Anniversary gala Thursday night.

"President Clinton spent many years learning how to play the saxophone and President Bush has spent many years learning how to play the radio," he joked as the crowd cheered.

“Rather than change President Bush’s failed policy in Iraq, roadblock Republicans continued to side with George Bush and choose more of the same,” Kerry said. “This bill offered a new direction in Iraq, a policy worthy of our soldiers’ sacrifice, and pressure on Iraqi politicians to end their civil war. The Republicans instead chose loyalty to President Bush over our national security. I’ve been fighting for a deadline for redeployment for over a year. We’ve gained momentum and supporters and I intend to continue working with my colleagues on this issue until we force the Administration to come up with a new mission that can actually work.”

(Kayakbiker put up something in support of Kerry & Clelland - click on my name - apparently they have been dragged through the mud again)

Olbermann to Bush: "Your Hypocrisy Is So Vast"
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/092107A.shtml
Keith Olbermann says on "MSNBC Countdown": "in pimping General David Petraeus and in the violation of everything this country has been assiduously and vigilantly against for 220 years, you have tried to blur the gleaming
radioactive demarcation between the military and the political, and to portray your party as the one associated with the military, and your opponents as the ones somehow antithetical to it. You did it again today and you need to know how history will judge the line you just crossed. It is a line thankfully only the
first of a series that makes the military political, and the political, military. It is a line which history shows is always the first one crossed when a democratic government in some other country has started down the longslippery, suicidal slope towards a Military Junta."

stacked deck
Israel "Consulted US" before secret Syria attack
http://www.guardian.co.uk/syria/story/0,,2174293,00.html

Netanyahu is the last neocon the US should be dealing with

Can anyone stop this from being a trigger for war with Iran? Is some type of "provocation" scenario being set up? What is with the new French foreign minister's big talk & meeting with Condi Rice?

more
http://www.guardian.co.uk/syria/story/0,,2173899,00.html
neocon signatures
Likud - strikes on suspected nukes underground
- very little in MSM - none of the Presidential candidates or even Bush act like they even know it happened - any mention in Congress?

Very suspicious and troubling

Israel is acting as our "proxy" - it's a "dry run" for Iran

Pay attention not to what they say but what they do.

from my friend Alan, a tireless peacemaker and advocate for the homeless:

#1 Karl Rove is gone.
#2 Alberto Gonzales is gone.
#3 Blackwater is finally getting some heat and being asking to LEAVE IRAQ. That's almost HALF of the MILITARY in IRAQ depending on whose counting....
#4 George has an astounding 29% Approval Rating ..... CNN I think!
#5 Up to 20,000 AMERICANS from all over the country marched on Jena , La. yesterday.
#6 Criminal Investigators are looking into $6 billion dollars worth of War Contracts.....you can bet Halliburton is circling the wagons!! And I know its a drop in the $bucket$.........but a start!
#7 Then there is O J .............
#8 And one of my All Time Favorites- the W. R. Grace Corp. was finally cleared by the 9th U. S. Circuit Court of Appeals to get CRIMINALLY SUED. [ RAYGUN JUST LOVED W. R. GRACE !] . Had a VET I knew who died of lung disease from these crooks! A nasty death..........
#9 Ted Stevens our Alaskan Senator Curmudgeon has the FBI all over him!
#10 And lastly- one of the most interesting Americans I know [ GREG MORTENSON ] is coming to Seattle Sunday to talk about his book [ "THREE CUPS OF TEA " ] and his 10 year effort to provide health clinics and to educate girls in Pakistan and Afghanistan..... AC

BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) -- The U.S. military on Friday reported the deaths of two U.S. soldiers in northern Iraq.

One soldier, from Task Force Lightning, was killed Thursday in Diyala province when an explosion occurred near his vehicle, the military said. A second soldier was wounded.

Another Task Force Lightning soldier also died Thursday in a noncombat-related incident in Tameem province, where Kirkuk is located.

The number of U.S. military deaths in the Iraq war stands at 3,794, including seven civilian employees of the Defense Department. The death toll for September is 52.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/09/21/iraq.main/index.html

NBC News: Bail denied for 'Jena Six' defendant Mychal Bell

It's not just communities like Jena where there are racism and intolerance. Try Mill Creek, Washington - a suburb near here. This is the story I saw in the lobby as I came back from lunch. For shame. How can we "spread democracy" when we have this level of hate right here in our country? (You can't "spread democracy" anyway - that's an oxymoron)
http://www.heraldnet.com/article/20070921/NEWS01/709210055

You know, I would bet money on it that in georgies mind, Mandela really was killed by Saddam.

I mean, nevermind saddam did not kill him and Mandela is not dead, I bet somebody has been playing with georgies head and he bought it, hook, line and sinker.

A spontainious outburst of total freaking lunacy is never as spontainious as it appears to be.

I would bet money on it that george w bush absolutely believes saddam killed Nelson.

Creepy.

Posted by: nmp at September 21, 2007 02:15 PM

Keith Olbermann had an emergency appendectomy on Monday, but he's devoted enough to be back on the air with his special comment. Watch it after after you read my favorite line:

The president was, according to Olbermann, "behaving a little more than usual like we'd all interrupted him while he was watching his favorite cartoons on the DVR."

Article and video:

http://rawstory.com//news/2007/Keith_Olbermann_Special_Comment_on_Bushs_0920.html

Bush's bootmaker jailed for smuggling illegal animal skins into the country
http://www.comcast.net/news/international/index.jsp?cat=INTERNATIONAL&fn=/2007/09/21/769426.html&cvqh=itn_bootmaker

Posted by: nmp at September 21, 2007 02:27 PM

And don't forget North Korea supposedly helping Syria get nukes.

This rumor is already gospel in reactionary, neocon-infested Koreatown USA.

I think fear moves us, but it's almost like this country is being held hostage for the (what?) almighty dollar.

Maybe it is money that motivates people.

I just stumbled across the video (from Australia, I believe) on the unreleased ABu Ghraib photos. I got through part of it - it is ugly and disgusting. If I have the stomach for it I will watch the whole segment:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ru0bxSqWMdo

I have three new videos up at You Tube.

IRAQ DIARY, SEPTEMBER 2007

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbAHl33mYNg

This is a collection of photos taken in Iraq in the last two weeks - no music yet - I haven't had the time to get a good/ appropriate recording of music to it.

WAR FOR OIL AND EMPIRE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHpeE5iWfUA

This is pretty good video - the best as far as music is concerned, which I spent a good deal of time on.

HILLARY's MONEY (with poorly played music)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gn-EfstfsxY

If I have the time I will re-record the music which I like but played badly and didn't edit very well, and upload again... etc...

The irony of this MoveOn situation is that the GOP spin doctors are now comparing opponents of this war to Neville Chamberlain, and accusing Democrats of a policy of appeasment. I saw one of these snakes on the Situation Room on Tuesday or Wednesday. Now, as far as I'm concerned, that charge is, at best, every bit as offensive as anything that MoveOn did (and potentially much more offensive). But I didn't see Wolf Blitzer make much of it.

These psycho-cons get away with smear after smear, and I rarely if ever see the media take them down for it.

from my friend Alan, a tireless peacemaker and advocate for the homeless:

#1 Karl Rove is gone.
#2 Alberto Gonzales is gone.
#3 Blackwater is finally getting some heat and being asking to LEAVE IRAQ. That's almost HALF of the MILITARY in IRAQ depending on whose counting....
#4 George has an astounding 29% Approval Rating ..... CNN I think!

@@@@@@@@@@

And the Democrats are STILL SCARED, LITTLE CHILDREN afraid of Bush...

My more paranoid liberal friends are worried about war with Iran...

Another whistleblower has reported at Kos regarding Bush's AG nomination:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/9/21/16467/5908

... and I seriously doubt that Rove is gone... he's more free to wreak havoc now that he's not in an "official" capacity.

Once a Turdblossom, always a Turdblossom

Posted by: monkey at September 21, 2007 08:03 PM

zactly!

TED KOPPEL ON IRAQ AND BLACKWATER

Ted Koppel seems determined to make the United States stay at least 5 more years perhaps 10, in Iraq. First his essay on Hillary Clinton saying that she (as quoted by his source) if elected president would have the U.S. stay another 8 years (her hypothetical two terms). Now today's essay by Koppel about how Blackwater and private contractors will be in Iraq "for a good long time".

Blackwater: In Iraq to Stay?

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=14599241

All Things Considered, September 21, 2007 · The U.S. security firm Blackwater USA has come under a great deal of fire from Iraqi authorities after some of its operatives were blamed for a shooting that cost civilian lives. But the truth is, the company will be needed even more if a drawdown of U.S. troops occurs. And a move to revoke Blackwater's license might ultimately undermine Iraqi government authority.

My more paranoid liberal friends are worried about war with Iran...

Posted by: Ralpheh at September 21, 2007 07:51 PM

Why stop at Iran. There's Syria and North Korea as well. And no doubt many others that Dubya has his greedy eyes upon.

Once a Turdblossom, always a Turdblossom

Posted by: monkey at September 21, 2007 08:03 PM

yep

I just stumbled across the video (from Australia, I believe) on the unreleased ABu Ghraib photos. I got through part of it - it is ugly and disgusting. If I have the stomach for it I will watch the whole segment:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ru0bxSqWMdo

Posted by: Ralpheh at September 21, 2007 07:47 PM

Yes, it is from Australia, Ralph. George Negus is the front guy for the program Dateline which screens every Wednesday night. On occasion I've slipped a link in about Iraq. An Australian Correspondent in Iraq - not one hiding out safely in the green zone - but one moving around amongst enemies and friends - often has a piece on the program.

This one I missed though and it is truly appalling. I was so shocked I sent it to my sister and brotherinlaw who live in Oregon, support Bush and believe the crap about terrorists in Iraq and fighting for our country. As we all know, there were no terrorists in Iraq until we invaded. There was a dictator who we managed to have hung. His civilian deaths/murders make a mere fraction of those caused by the occupiers.

And now the country is running by a proxy infidel dictator, GWBush, through the installed Maliki. Which Iraqi wanted Maliki in charge?

Bush's Mandela gaffe 'out there'
THE Nelson Mandela Foundation has confirmed that the former South African leader is still alive, after President Bush alluded to his death in a bizarre comment.
http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,22461883-2,00.html

Feds Probing Iraq Arms Smuggling By Blackwater Guards

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/huff-wires/20070921/us-blackwater-probe/

Posted by: rossiann at September 21, 2007 11:22 PM

How to lose friends and stop influencing people.

More of the same

Bush's 'Rangers', CEOs, Switching Sides To Dems in '08 Race »
Bloomberg | Michael Janofsky | September 21, 2007 08:19 PM

Dozens of corporate executives who backed President George W. Bush for re-election in 2004, including some of his top fund-raisers, are now helping Democrats running for president.

John Mack, chief executive officer of Morgan Stanley, Rupert Murdoch, chairman of News Corp., and Terry Semel, chairman of Yahoo! Inc., are among some 60 executives writing checks to Democrats such as Senators Hillary Clinton of New York and Barack Obama of Illinois, a review of U.S. Federal Election Commission records shows.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=afaR_KaZJEds

That's Two, hope it keeps up

Rumsfeld Appointment Draws "Fierce Protests" At Stanford University »

New York Times | September 21, 2007 01:00 PM

The appointment of Donald H. Rumsfeld, the former defense secretary, as a distinguished visiting fellow at the Hoover Institution is drawing fierce protests from faculty members and students at Stanford University and is threatening to rekindle tensions between the institution, a conservative research body, and the more liberal campus.

Some 2,100 professors, staff members, students and alumni have signed an online petition protesting Mr. Rumsfeld's appointment, which will involve advising a task force on ideology and terrorism. Faculty members say he...
New York Times | September 21, 2007 01:00 PM

The appointment of Donald H. Rumsfeld, the former defense secretary, as a distinguished visiting fellow at the Hoover Institution is drawing fierce protests from faculty members and students at Stanford University and is threatening to rekindle tensions between the institution, a conservative research body, and the more liberal campus.

Some 2,100 professors, staff members, students and alumni have signed an online petition protesting Mr. Rumsfeld's appointment, which will involve advising a task force on ideology and terrorism. Faculty members say he...
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/21/education/21stanford.html?_r=2&adxnnl=1&oref=slogin&ref=washington&adxnnlx=1190392962-elUa1KO3/okaQEcK3LYxyQ&oref=slogin

Rumsfeld Speech Canceled After "Too Many People Objected"
Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld was supposed to speak to the Wichita Metro Chamber of Commerce in Kansas on Dec. 4. But today the Wichita Eagle reports that his appearance was quietly canceled last month after “too many people objected.” The Chamber, which is traditionally conservative, is now expecting to hear from former White House Press Secretary Tony Snow, who recently joined the speaker’s circuit.

http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/20/rumsfeld-speech-nixed-after-too-many-people-objected/

hn Mack, chief executive officer of Morgan Stanley, Rupert Murdoch, chairman of News Corp., and Terry Semel, chairman of Yahoo! Inc., are among some 60 executives writing checks to Democrats such as Senators Hillary Clinton of New York and Barack Obama of Illinois, a review of U.S. Federal Election Commission records shows.

Posted by: rossiann at September 21, 2007 11:35 PM

Rupert Murdoch??? That's a worry. I'm certain that he hasn't developed a conscience. Why are his newspapers still so heavily weighted on the blood-for-oil side? I don't know the others.

Ralpheh
I have liked some of the Ted Koppel NPR broadcasts but I was horrified to research him a little more and find his stance on Blackwater and embedding of reporters and other stuff. Can't be trusted. He is no Dan Rather.

Liberals I know are also having a sense of foreboding that Iran could be struck and I know I've been following the Israel/Syria thing. Did you see the articles this morning in the Guardian?

I often agree with you. There are just things I do not write on-line because I know from last election that things we said during the primary were used against the Democratic candidate in the general election. We need free speech but I for one want to be pretty darn careful. Therefore, I always diss Republicans before attacking Dems, though putting pressure on them is good.

I wish there weren't so many of those conservative "blue dog" ones who may cross the aisles and was horrified at how many voted to sanction MoveOn. I was shocked the Congress and Bush even paid attention to MoveOn. I was shocked when O'Reilly compared YearlyKos to Nazis and Ku Klux Klan. It means we matter but I also don't think the progressive blogosphere should ever let it go to their heads because I think there are still alot of moderate Dems in this country.

Now more people are against the war but I don't trust alot of them to really warm to progressive causes that much. This is just what I've seen so far in my life, and it's disappointing.

Posted by: rossiann at September 21, 2007 11:48 PM

Hopefully Rumsfeld's appointment to Stanford for his extremely long public service and his knowledge on terrorism, won't happen. He is an insult to all who study at that institution.

However, they could write courses for while he's there to teach students that torture and murder are useless tools when dealing with terrorists. Teach them that in order to defeat terrorists at their game, becoming terrorists creates a bigger quagmire of evils. Just like we've done for the past 6 years.

And of course, the faculty of law could use the constitution and habeas corpus legislation to show exactly what Rumsfeld did wrong. He could be encased in a glass box for a year with an orange (or maybe yellow is more his colour) over his head, whilst torture and Habeas Corpus are discussed - and trialled. Research the usefulness of torture. Of course you would have to find a torturer because #1 torturer of the world will be in the box.

Can anyone tell me how to contact the PBS people? I trawled the home page and couldn't find a way to contact via email. I have some complaints. I have some congratulations also. But the complaints leave me hyperventilating with no place to hyperventilate at. If you get me.

The dateline YouTube with all those horrifying pictures of torture, brutality and sadism is the product of an excellent and independent weekly current affairs tv program called Dateline. I've run through and chosen to read some transcripts from April 2003. There are 50 pages of the interviews and/or transcripts. You might like to have a look. I always read what Gore Vidal has to say, whenever I come across it, regardless of having seen it before. He is very smart. Actually he's more than that, he's conversant with all the facts. And precious few of the decision-makers are. Shame we can't have an intelligent person at the head of the developed world.

http://news.sbs.com.au/sales/catalog.php?search=1&b=p&t=Dateline&page=30#

And - with regard to General Betrayus. I don't care who called him that. His job is to go out and make his soldiers KILL KILL KILL. That's what he gets paid for.

And he's hurt by a little name-calling? Give me a break. What's he General of? The Teddy Bears' Picnic? His business is killing until he gets to win. Then he'd get even more medals to pin on himself. Go pick up the teddy and give it a hug, General Betrayus.

And the republicans and media that are giving this so much credence - go take a dose of codliveroil or whatever will actually clean you of all the crap you are so full of.

Sorry, dcpers. This is why I wanted to email PBS.

"And - with regard to General Betrayus. I don't care who called him that. His job is to go out and make his soldiers KILL KILL KILL. "

His job is to flack for the bush administration. He is the fixer that makes sure the 'facts' fit the policy.

And no, Woz. I have no idea how to contact PBS.

Is there a peace and justice MOVEMENT?

Ofcourse there is, but peacemakers have a funny way of getting murdered in public and the prowar people are still better armed than the pacifists.

Is it actually MOVING?

Yup. Right off a cliff.

Are you MOVED by anything the MOVEMENT has done?

Not really. Sorta. Maybe. It depends.

What is the engine for the MOVEMENT?

Passion and fear.

What would MOVE you to action?

Knowing we were actually focused on the right target. Or you could try bribing us with drugs and hookers.

Do you ever think about MOVING on?

How can we? I mean, seriously, how could any of us walk away at this point...?

We all know what is happening here, and we all know the stakes. Some of us try to stay positive, some of us can not help but be pessimistic and cynical, but all of us know what happens if we fail.

So goes the nation with us.

rossi mentioned earlier, but now top story on all news this morning...

Blackwater faces arms smuggling probe

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Federal prosecutors are investigating allegations that employees of Blackwater -- the security firm accused of shooting dead up to 20 Iraqi civilians -- illegally smuggled weapons into Iraq, according to U.S. government sources.

Security operations by North Carolina-based Blackwater USA, which is hired by the U.S. State Department to guard U.S. staff in Iraq, were suspended this week amid concerns by Iraqi and U.S. government officials over the shootings in Baghdad last weekend. Normal operations resumed Friday, the State Department said.

One U.S. government official said the U.S. attorney's office in Raleigh, North Carolina, is in the early stages of an investigation that so far focuses on individual Blackwater employees and not the company.

Another senior U.S. government official said the State Department had been cooperating with the prosecutors in the probe.

The first public hint that an investigation was under way came earlier this week in a statement from State Department Inspector General Howard Krongard in response to allegations that he blocked fraud investigations in Afghanistan and Iraq.

"In particular, I made one of my best investigators available to help assistant U.S. attorneys in North Carolina in their investigation into alleged smuggling of weapons into Iraq by a contractor," Krongard's statement said.

Neither the U.S. attorney nor Blackwater officials had been reached for comment by Friday evening.

The flow of illegal weapons in Iraq has been a major concern in recent months.

more...
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/09/22/blackwater.probe/index.html

Iraq probe of U.S. security firm grows
Blackwater, accused of killing 11 on Sunday, cited in earlier deaths

BAGHDAD - Iraq's probe into a deadly shooting by Blackwater USA in Baghdad last weekend has expanded to include allegations about the security firm's involvement in six other violent episodes this year that left at least 10 Iraqis dead.

The incidents include the killing of three guards at a state-run media complex and the shooting death of an Iraqi journalist outside the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, said Brig. Gen. Abdul-Karim Khalaf, chief spokesman for the Interior Ministry.

Iraqi officials say these violent encounters have made them increasingly frustrated with Blackwater's conduct in Iraq, but the government backed away Friday from its attempt to expel the company. Blackwater has said its guards acted appropriately in the weekend incident, but it did not respond to requests for comment Friday on the other episodes cited by Khalaf.

"These acts, this is what made the Ministry of Interior stop trusting them," Khalaf said in an interview. He said the ministry's findings would be referred to court for possible criminal prosecution.

Bassam Ridha, a senior adviser to Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki, conceded that the Iraqi government, at least for now, cannot follow through on a ban on Blackwater, even though the firm has been operating without a license for more than a year. "The reality of the matter is we can't do that," Ridha said.

more...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20913649/from/RS.2/

U.S. restricts lawyers' access to Gitmo prisoners
Attorneys at least 40 inmates barred after judge dismisses legal challenge

SAN JUAN, Puerto Rico - Attorneys for at least 40 Guantanamo Bay prisoners have been barred from visiting or writing their clients because of a judge’s order dismissing legal challenges to the men’s confinement, the U.S. Department of Justice said Friday.

A Justice Department lawyer informed the attorneys of the new restrictions in an e-mail that cited Thursday’s dismissal of their cases by District Court Judge Ricardo Urbina in Washington.

“In light of this development, counsel access (both legal mail and in-person visits) is no longer permitted,” Justice Department lawyer Andrew I. Warden said in the e-mail.

Urbina’s ruling, which covered 16 legal petitions filed on behalf of 40-60 detainees, invalidated an order that establishes rules for contact with detainees, Warden said.

Challenges are still pending for dozens of other detainees with the Supreme Court set to consider whether Congress had the right to strip the prisoners of the right to contest their confinement with petitions of habeas corpus.

The Justice Department letter outlined a series of legal steps that would be required before the attorneys could resume contact with the detainees.

But attorney Wells Dixon said he would most likely not be able to complete those measures in time for a scheduled visit with a Libyan client in October.

That visit is crucial, Dixon said, because he is in the midst of trying to prevent the government from transferring the client back to Libya, where his lawyers fear he will be tortured.

“This is just the latest example of the government’s efforts to frustrate counsel access to detainees,” he said.

more...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20916549/

Posted by: monkey at September 22, 2007 09:02 AM

Most people even in Government, want Gitmo to go away. And yet a judge ..... a judge ....... can forbid prisoners from access in any format with their lawyers.

It's hard to believe that they can get worse. But they have.

U.S. family seeks political asylum in Finland
Family with three young kids will get answer in several months, officials say

HELSINKI, Finland - An American family with three small children has applied for political asylum in Finland, immigration officials said Friday.

The five family members came to Finland on Tuesday from Germany, said Minna Serradj from the Directorate of Immigration.

“It’s very unusual for a U.S. citizen to apply for asylum,” Serradj said, declining to give details in line with a policy to protect asylum seekers. “I don’t remember when we last had Americans applying.”

Serradj declined to comment on local media speculation that the parents possibly were seeking to escape serving in the U.S. armed forces in Iraq.

“We will handle the case just like all the others,” she said, adding a decision will be made in three to six months.

more...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20913414/

Collecting of details on travelers documented
Gathering of personal information violates Privacy Act, activists contend

The U.S. government is collecting electronic records on the travel habits of millions of Americans who fly, drive or take cruises abroad, retaining data on the persons with whom they travel or plan to stay, the personal items they carry during their journeys, and even the books that travelers have carried, according to documents obtained by a group of civil liberties advocates and statements by government officials.

The personal travel records are meant to be stored for as long as 15 years, as part of the Department of Homeland Security's effort to assess the security threat posed by all travelers entering the country. Officials say the records, which are analyzed by the department's Automated Targeting System, help border officials distinguish potential terrorists from innocent people entering the country.

But new details about the information being retained suggest that the government is monitoring the personal habits of travelers more closely than it has previously acknowledged. The details were learned when a group of activists requested copies of official records on their own travel. Those records included a description of a book on marijuana that one of them carried and small flashlights bearing the symbol of a marijuana leaf.

The Automated Targeting System has been used to screen passengers since the mid-1990s, but the collection of data for it has been greatly expanded and automated since 2002, according to former DHS officials.

Officials yesterday defended the retention of highly personal data on travelers not involved in or linked to any violations of the law. But civil liberties advocates have alleged that the type of information preserved by the department raises alarms about the government's ability to intrude into the lives of ordinary people. The millions of travelers whose records are kept by the government are generally unaware of what their records say, and the government has not created an effective mechanism for reviewing the data and correcting any errors, activists said.

The activists alleged that the data collection effort, as carried out now, violates the Privacy Act, which bars the gathering of data related to Americans' exercise of their First Amendment rights, such as their choice of reading material or persons with whom to associate. They also expressed concern that such personal data could one day be used impede their right to travel.

more...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20913640/

This one I missed though and it is truly appalling. I was so shocked I sent it to my sister and brotherinlaw who live in Oregon, support Bush and believe the crap about terrorists in Iraq and fighting for our country. As we all know, there were no terrorists in Iraq until we invaded. There was a dictator who we managed to have hung. His civilian deaths/murders make a mere fraction of those caused by the occupiers.

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I believe that these Abu Ghraib photos still have not been released by the Pentagon. And the ACLU is still in court over their release. I'll have to do more research/ contact the ACLU to find out about this...

Is there a peace and justice MOVEMENT?

Ofcourse there is, but peacemakers have a funny way of getting murdered in public and the prowar people are still better armed than the pacifists.

Is it actually MOVING?

Yup. Right off a cliff.

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Of course there are many dedicated, good-hearted and intelligent people in the peace movement.... The Code Pink people have been very good at getting the message out and dogging powerful people (most notably Hillary Clinton, Nancy Pelosi and John Conyers) who should know better.

BUT,

It must be said that as a political movement that brings about change, the peace movement has been something of a failure. Although the peace movement managed to help defeat Joe Lieberman in the Democratic primary, I was stunned that Lieberman was able to win the general election (as a third party candidate, no less) rather easily. This was a huge and bitter defeat. We lack a political strategy and lobbying strategy. I am thinking of successful interest groups - National Rifle Association - and how well they mobilize the members and pressure Congress. This is the great failure of the peace movement - not pressuring Congress and not succeeding with anti-war candidates.

As a matter of fact, I have a great ignorance and lack of interest in politics which has hurt the movement.

The "movement" also lacks a clear, popular leader. Although I like Cindy Sheehan, fiesty and intelligent, and she has done great of motivating people and organizing, she rubs many (the undecided/ middle America etc.) the wrong way.

I think, as well, that Sheehan's extra-curricular views - on corporate America, the military, economic injustice - may have hurt the movement's focus and alientated potential supporters. While I agree with most of what Sheehan says, this is irrelevant to the more important goal of ending the war and gaining broad-based support.

Perhaps we need a less shrill, more sober voice in the peace movement - perhaps someone like Barbara Lee. I like Sheehan - but she is not many people's cup of tea. Remember the peace and justice movement of the 60's and how MLK always wore a suit and tie and spoke in measured tones - we need someone (HUGE WISH!!!!) like that....

Ralpheh,

PLease see the new thread header and let us hear your thoughts. There will be no easy answers to your concerns, which I share.